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Needs Watery Graves instead of Underground River. Then you can add fetches to make it faster
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As a huge fan of Heartless Summoning decks, +1. But also there are some really cool things you can do with this engine that you may not know about. The first is that with Heartless Summoning and Havengul Lich, you can throw down Perilous Myr for unlimited Shocks at sorcery speed. Another really fantastic thing is that (even without the Lich) Phyrexian Reclaimers are fantastic in this set up. With the Lich they're ridiculous, and if you get two of them they form an infinite loop. This is a good reason to include something like Falkenrath Noble, which would not be a bad inclusion anyways. Yet another cool thing is that Priest of Urabrask with Heartless Summoning and Havengul Lich is unlimited red mana, but you don't have that much to use it on so that little combo would probably be shelved for this deck. Mulldrifter would be a HUGE draw engine here, letting you infinitely draw 2 cards for 1u at sorcery speed. Oh and Solemn Simulacrum is an automatic 4 of, he's just value off the chart.
Myr Retriever interacts very well with Heartless Summoning and Falkenrath Noble. So well, in fact, that ist an instant win if your opponent cant kill your noble.
Or interrupt your casting of myr retriever.
Oh whoops that's actually the card I was talking about. I don't know where I got "Phyrexian Reclaimer"
Phyrexian reclamation is a card and probably the one you were thinking of
no
The problem with heartless summoning decks is that when you have heartless summoning in feild they are really really good. When they don't they suffer. I don't know of a good way to fix it though
I feel like since having 2 heartless summonings in play kind of ruins half your creatures you would be better off playing with just 3 copies. So you don't end up with a dead card in hand. Then again given how integral it is to the deck functioning, maybe its alright to risk a dead card.
The second one. The card is 500% necessary and if the opponent is smart they Abrupt Decay it. Drawing dead Heartless Summonings is something you have to live with.
I just hate dead cards so much.
he could also take and put in cards to discard that do good things like vevilion clique for the draw
Not a generally bad idea, but Clique would die with a Heartless Summoning active.
its effect would still go on the stack even if it dies.
Yes, but it's not worth much without the body. UU to discard and draw? Not good enough.
^lol @ this. Clique is not a $55 card because it is a 3/1 flyer. being able to steal their draw step by flashing it in and gaining full knowledge of the turn, and being able to disrupt anything they have that can change the game is. the ability is ABSOLUTELY worth UU.
Clique is 50+ dollar card because of both. If you lose the body you might as well run thiughtseize
you cant thoughtseize someone in their drawstep. I dont think you fully understand why Clique is a top card.
I do, lose the body and it's not a top card. It's a 2 mana discard spell that gives them a new card.
that ability at that speed is what makes it a top card, not the body. You get to look at their hand in their draw step, and if you need to protect your combo, or whatever, you force them to bottom a hate card, and gamble that they draw another one. Vendilion Clique would be a $35-40 card without that body. the power/toughness is an afterthought. Lifebane Zombie is a 3/1 with a similar ability, and it is an $8 card, and that is only because it is in standard. ittl be a $1 rare once it rotates. if you could flash it in, the price would skyrocket. EVERY player who plays Clique knows that it will not survive in a world full of lightning bolts, helix, and electrolyze, so if its going to die immediately, then why play it at all?
Well you play other creatures. Dies to removal is only relevant if the removal is otherwise dead. Every lightning bolt at clique is 3 damage not to your face. If clique eats path then havengull lich survives.The pseudo-discard with a body is why it's played. Remove either and it's barely playable to not playable at all.
no. you lose the ability, and its unplayable. you lose the body and it is still a top 2 hand hate card.
By your argument a card like Lurking Informant is actually better than Clique, since it can produce an almost identical effect multiple times. Last time I checked that card is pennies. As with many great cards, it is no one feature of the card that makes it great. Clique is a fairy, a flash blocker, a draw step nullifier, and an evasive 3 damage. It's a beautiful thing. But the ETB effect alone for UU is good but not great. Try again.
I stated multiple times that its instant speed is what makes it relevant. Try again? go fist your grandma kid.
No seriously by your argument why is Lurking Informant not $50+? What you're talking about is the ability to nullify a draw, or fateseal. That's what Informant does. It can do so repeatedly, and with less mana specificity. Can you give me a civil answer to that question?What about Esper Charm? Piracy Charm? Funeral Charm? I agree that the ability is the most important part. It definitely is. You are right. But if it was LITERALLY the only thing that mattered on the card, wouldn't the other cards I mentioned would be played instead? Also did you literally downvote every comment I put on this thread, regardless of whether it was related? You're pretty salty dude
MY argument was that the ability to flash in a hand hate spell is the most relevant part of the card, and the 3/1 flyer is an afterthought. Lurking informant does not do anything near that. Youre just talking out of your ass.
So, based on your phrasing, you admit that although instant speed hand hate is the most important part, there are other "relevant" parts of the card
go read my initial comment. "the ability on the card is what makes it a top card, not the body" The card would still be an expensive card if it were an instant speed spell with the same ability on no body. it would not be $50+, but it would be over 30, because people play Clique for the ability.
So we were actually saying the same thing, just disagreeing on the degree to which the body mattered. I will maintain that people would never play the effect for UU as an instant because that's technically negative card advantage. Although in practice it doesn't feel this way, Vendilion Clique is actually neutral card advantage and without the body it's you trading one of your cards to potentially make their hand in worse shape. That's not even close to the same thing in my book
it is negative card advantage, but it typically results being able to choose how your opponent interacts with you or your board for the next turn or so, and at the very least provides you with perfect information. you can also target yourself to dump an extra Leyline (or something)drawn late game and draw something relevant, which is not negative card advantage at all. regardless, this has become a stale point.
I agree. Stale. Since we're done arguing, I'll just be off to "fist my grandma" then
say hi for me
As king of trolls I demand you cease and desist sir.
Who downvoted me for hating dead cards at the top of the thread? is there someone out there who likes dead cards?
Did you ever give any thought to bloodgift demon? Your deck would also benefit from one more falkenrath noble and some myr retrievers. Having the option of the combo is nice, and it would allow to get back myr superions or perilous myrs.