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Tournament Quality Mill Deck for Legacy Built to get the Painter and Grindstone out and finish that game by turn 3. Note: I COMPLETELY forgot to put in the mind funerals. I have em in now, and have reduced the amount of land.
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get rid of traumatize for archive trap or add keening stone for another total mill combo and add fabricate
Keening stone is overrated, the card costs 5 mana, and 6 to play. By turn 6 your opponents deck should be wiped out. Archive Trap is decent, but I'd use it as a sideboard card if I was playing like an Elf Deck for example, lots of "Search your library" type cards. Fabricate isn't even milling related, unless you play Keening Stone, which as I previously stated, you shouldn't. It's an okay card don't get me wrong, but just overrated and not burst mill in my opinion.
well with the use of fabricate if u dont pull either the grindstone or the painter's servant the fabricate lets u pull those
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I like the idea you got rockin here in some regards. First, I'd knock out all the tainted isles, and a couple more land. You don't really need 31 land, that's over doing it. I'd say stick with like 4 Dimir Aqueducts, 8 Islands, and 8 Swamp. The Dimir aqueduct goes as a great combo if you have to for a 3 card mill per turn via Hedron Crab. I'd say get some more creature also. Here's my mill deck and you can take a look at it. My opinion, your rocking way to much mana, and it's taking up alot of your deck, especially with your Sapphire Medallion/Painter combo knocking out mana cost. Though it's a colorless cost, and that only comes into effect for Traumatize, of which you don't really need 4 of, but I see why you have 4. And Grindstone is pretty baller, but meh. I'd rather spend the mana on a Glimpse/Mind Funeral/etc. etc. Anyhow, yeah here's my U/B Mill deck. http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=77916
Grindstone is meh? Combo'ed with Painter, you can mill their entire library in one turn for three mana :)
tutors help and a sadistic sacrement will help against annoying hit graveyard/reshuffle cards and traumatze gets weak when deck is slim so a mind funeral would be a better 4x in my opinion
Traumatize will go good if you run a Dark Ritual in your deck, get it out by turn 3 is fun and mill for 25 cards! Though you definatley do not need 4 traumatizes. Also sadistic sacrement is...okay. Definately not mill material though. Just play some nice Haunting Echoes, cause if they run a card does that, chances are they have multiple, and chances are you milled one of the multiple. Bam all out of play.
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if u milled it, the effect immediately reshuffles it in....so at least sideboard because in this case haunting them will be ineffective...
I see what your suggesting. Something like Emrakul, goes to the graveyard, reshuffle the deck. Fair enough, sideboard, but not maindeck. For those just in case moments.
Damn, that grindstone/painter combo is spiffy. Does the sapphire work well with only traumatize? Definitely needs some sideboard with instant graveyard removal for those pesky Eldrazi people love to sideboard just for mill. Overall it seems like a very focused and quick mill deck.
I wouldn't say it's quick. And yeah the sapphire knocks out 1 colorless mana from any card, he uses painter to make everything blue, so it knocks out only 1 colorless mana. But the only mill cards he has besides Grindstone that has colorless is Traumatize. So it's not fully realized.
The Painter's Servant isn't to make the rest of the spells in the deck easier to play. It's just a happy coincidence that it works out with Trauma. The main focus for Painter is to combo with Grindstone so that lands could not interrupt Grindstone's ability. The rest of the deck is essentially a "Plan B" until the combo comes out. ...How is a turn 3 win not quick for a Mill Deck?
That being said, there really isn't much reason for the sapphire medallion to be in there, anyway, and has been removed.
maybe instead of siding in sadistic sacrament you should try leyline of the void? I understand it wouldnt get rid of eldrazi but they would have to draw them eventually. Also leyline is much more effective agains a dredge or unearth deck. Also i agree with Zelanoth, you should probably take out like 4 land and put 4 mind funerals in their place.
Actually, Leyline of the Void WOULD handle the Graveyard/Reshuffle issue of the Eldrazi. For instance, if Emrakul got milled with LOTV out, it would never hit the graveyard, therefore, no reshuffle.
since this is legacy format i would subjest 4 lotus petals and 4 brainstorms helps get card advangage and to get the grindstone kill quicker and i agree about the mana comment cut it down to 20 and add more things to get the grindstone combo, trinket mage can fetch grindstone and muddle the mixture can be used to transmute for painters servant other than that it looks good i would add tormods crypt to remove thier graveyard like some other people subjested take a look at my vintage grindstone for more ideas its pretty rediculous http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=65724
@ digwood "Actually, Leyline of the Void WOULD handle the Graveyard/Reshuffle issue of the Eldrazi. For instance, if Emrakul got milled with LOTV out, it would never hit the graveyard, therefore, no reshuffle." I stand corrected sir. For some reason i thought they had the same wording as darksteel colossus (if it WOULD be sent to the graveyard...) but they do not. Good catch.
Out of curiosity, is this built to go tournament standard? Only reason I ask is this has been built to go third turn (seen this done many a time from my friends painter/grindstone deck) but with no control, how would you plan on containing the likes of wheel of sun and moon which could be dropped second turn by your opponent (so doesn't matter if you have turn advantage). Leyline of the Void is a beautiful stop against the Eldrazi anti mill and the likes of Gaea's blessing, but a second turn wheel is going to kill this deck... Like the idea, but I think the sideboard has GOT to become a lot more responsive as looks to be vulnerable in many ways in a tournament environment (no beat stop). Like it, but think it needs some work yet. :)
how many decks really play wheel of sun and moon and or even sideboard wheel of sun and moon?
From my experience? Any deck that splashes green or white. WOSAM helps against so many decks it's unreal. Had a lot of experience dealing with it at the last local tourney. Seen them run main deck in some instances. especially the likes of to tier enchantress deck...
I absolutely HATE this combo, it's SO CHEAP... unless I'm using it... MWAHAHAHAHAHA! Good deck!
Holy hell. I just tried a sample hand and got T1: Island, Hedron Crab T2: swamp, Glimpse the Unthinkable T3: Swamp, Mind Funeral T4: Island, 2x Glimpse the Unthinkable. Wat.
I have to go back to the haunting echoes. After a traumatize or even a couple mind funerals, done, no contest. Your opponent has what ever he's got on the field and maybe a couple others. Maybe. It's kind of a backup to the other combo, but if the first fails, then you're gonna need one. Another popular approach is Necromancer's Covenant, with an optional death baron and Lich Lord of Unx, but that may be too much of an entirely different direction. But haunting echoes i think is a must.
I LOVE THIS DECK. Evil evil and FAST, brutal even in the worst conditions. Throw one more card in your sideboard for legality and I would TOTALLY play this. :D
painter and grindstone... one of the worst combo ever... to play against. its hilarious to use a deck like this one or 2 times, but its not what i call fun playing. it gets old fast, and your opponent dont really like playing with you. it goes without saying thats its the same thing with other abusive combos like those infinite myr kill. (splinter twin, mana myr, myr galvanizer)
just a point of clarification... can land be made colored by painter? i know it says permanaents become the chosen color, but i wasnt sure if that affected lands, which are colorless by definition... If it does, that's an insane combo...
"All cards that aren't in play, spells, and permanents are the chosen color in addition to their other colors." Last I checked, lands are permanents, so yes, they can be given a color.
You need force of will.
Does the lack of creatures ever leave you open? It seems like you would be vulnerable if you dont draw the right cards.
You're missing the point of a mill deck. Having few to no creatures doesn't matter when you're not letting your opponent have any either. ^.~
Demonic tutor dude... nuff said.
The only thing I can think of is Sadistic Sacriment kicked combo'ed with Mind funeral. Remove a lot of their lands and mill a huge portion of their library only it's really expensive although I would main-deck Sadistic as you can use it at any time to remove Graveyard shufflers such as Emakrul AND if/when you have the mana you can finish them off with the mentioned combo.
Oh ye olden standby of the pink glitch(Yes the colour is arbitrary, but we use pink), will you ever go old? Also, may want to find a way to deal with the possibility of your opponent running leyline of sanctity, just a thought.
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Wow, that deck is straight up wicked....
Nice way of winning with even having to attack your opponent. Here's mine lol http://www.mtgvault.com/EditDeck.aspx?DeckID=115238
Why not use Fabricate in place of Diabolic Tutor? More than likely the only thing you'll need to search for is the other piece of the combo you still need, and they're both artifacts, so Fabricate is a perfect cheaper and less color-dependent solution.
Fun! I love it
I'm not quite sure about legacy rules, but why not add a jace the mindsculptor? or ever a jace beleren. mindsculptor is a deff. mill, and his control along the way is awesome. jace beleren is a great draw engine. just keep gainign card advantage. like i said, it's just my two cents. and jace the m.s is quite expensive, so, w/e works. butttt, if you get time, can you check my u/b control? i'd really appreciate some advice on it. http://mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=113784 thanks, and hope i wasn't completely irrelevant. lol
I play a mill deck Legacy. Personally, I prefer to run Leyline main deck. You know you are only going to have to sideboard it in regardless on game 2, so may as well start with it in the deck to start with. Also, that amount of graveyard hate first game causes major issues with the likes of the top tier reanimator decks etc and can get you an easy win game 1 without even playing a card. Since you're using Hedron crab, I would suggest looking at your mana base and swap out a lot of the basic lands for relevant fetch lands. the 'crabuse' is always phenomenal. Especially if you can get first turn island, crab, 2nd turn crab, fetch land. That's a mill for 8 on turn 2 without even batting an eyelid. I tried running twincast as well for a while, but found other cards work far better. Sure, it's nice if you've got the mana floating and can twincast say an archive trap, but normally you want to be really agressive with the mill cards and twincast kind of becomes redundant. I'd look at replacing the memory sluice and the traumatize with Archive traps main deck. By the time you've got the mana to cast traumatize, you don't really have much of your opponents deck left or you're dead. Memory sluice theoretically is better than a tome scour, but with only the hedron crab as your creature card you are rarely going to get conspire. Using archive trap can be so much more brutal. Think how many decks in legacy run even just fetch lands. I've seen opponents take first turn and set off a fetch with me sitting with an easy 26 mill before any of my land or spells hit the table. The tutors are nice to go for the cards you want, but 4 casting cost is expensive, and generally sets you back a turn. I'd perhaps either look at brainstorms or senseis divining top to control what you are drawing, rather than looking for cards. Especially if you do go with fetch lands. 3 cards of guff on the top? Shuffle them away with a fetch. reduce down like this and I think you could perhaps look at running only 22 land as it should sooth out your mana curve. I would suggest running 12 fetch and 10 land (if you can run dual land, even better but those underground seas are gonna be pricy!!! lol). Only other problem you will have will be against any beats decks. I'd suggest you need to look at some way to control this just long enough to get your combo pieces onto the table. But other than that, tasty enough. If you want, take a look at my deck which seems to be a very similar idea, just I wanted to make it without using the combo. http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=75606 I've edited it to roughly how I had it running last tourney. There's 3 cards short but i'm stuck at work and can't remember what they were. Think I may have ran 3x ensnaring bridge main deck and had something else sideboard, but you get the idea
Like it btw. Nice to see mill decks out there. :)
why no Underground sea, Watery Grave, or Polluted Delta?
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He wants to use the landfall ability every turn, hence the Dimir lands.
Granted, the Dimir gets 1x extra land drop, but still only gives 1x land drop per turn. Running fetch + relevant land (either underground sea for budgetless build or swamp/island for budget build) gives a drop of 2 land in 1x turn, activating the crabs twice. Much better system. For guaranteed land drop every turn, hold back an undiscovered paradise...
Try looking at "Sword of Body and Mind" It might be useful.
Sword of Body and Mind is tasty, but the only 'expendable' creature of the deck really is the Hedron crab, and run them the right way and they are going to bring a lot of creature hate online. Nemesis of Reason with a sword of body and mind however.... Ultra disgusting Mill, regards of whether it's blocked!!!! Personally, if you are looking at the sword, I would remove the traumatize and DEFINITELY replace them with Nemesis of reason. They're a far better five cast in any mill deck than A Traumatize will be.
Holy Crap! You're right! Nemesis of Reason would be an awesome addition to this deck. The only problem being that it's pricey (money-wise). Besides, for the sword, you may need cards with abilities that allow it to attack directly, like fly, deathtouch, or shadow.
Mundungu > Vodalian Mage i think, unless im missing something.
I run a similar mill deck being blue/black deck using the painters/grindstone combo. Some cards that have worked well for me are Circu, Dimir Lobotomist. You may want to try brain freeze instead of memory sluice since you can't really use memory sluice's abilities to the max. Nemesis of Reason has been mentioned before and another great option to consider. You basically have not protection so you need to get out the combo fast. Some additional drawing/search cards would benefit this deck. A card that doesn't see a lot of play but works well for me is Lim-Dul's Vault. If you are running four painters and grindstone, chances are you have at least one in your hand or have at least a 5 card section which can give you the other piece. Its has a very low casting cost and even if you don't want to search your library, you can still rearrange the top 5 cards of your library. Brainstorm, Ponder, Impulse may be some other good card drawing options. Archive trap as mentioned is a good option and sadistic sacrament allows you to not only remove three cards but more importantly allows you to see what the opponents deck is consisted of. Haunting Echoes might be another card to consider as well. Damnation would also be an option because with out any real protection or counters, chances are the opponent is going to be able to start dropping creatures and this provides the only real answer to clear the board. Just some suggestions or cards to check out or possibly consider
I'd really like to see this deck to be updated somewhat. I remember this deck when I first joined this sight and how amazing it was. It still is amazing, I would advise putting in Terramorphic Expanse for double landfall and possibly the new Jace in M12. He is 6 mana and you should win easily before turn 6, but just in case >.>
It's been a while since any comments have been made, but if I may, I'd throw in a couple of leyline of the void to avoid your opponent reshuffling his graveyard back into his library
Add leyline of sanctity to your sideboard. It protects against burn the same way leyline of the void protects against dredge.
Not bad but check this one out blue millby williammcpeak on 08 March 2013
Not bad but check this one out http://www.mtgvault.com/williammcpeak/decks/blue-mill/
labratory maniac should be able to help this deck for a second way to win if the first one does not work.