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The Combo or the Club?
Pretty simple, which seems to work better? Obviously it varies a bit with the deck but in my experience it seems the 'club' (as I'm calling them) tends to do better. Get heavy hitting creatures out or play burn spells for the win instead of trying to set up a game winning combo that requires a lucky draw instead of grabbing a low cost, heavy hitter every time.
So this is more of a philosophical type of discussion. Feel free to post examples or talk only in generalities, but which do you think will win more often: A combo (even one that's relatively quick to set up with a perfect draw) or something like an efficient green legacy or the like, a perfect draw of heavy hitting creatures and burns or buffs.
Zanmor
304 posts
Posted 19 July 2010 at 05:21
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Safearus
29 posts
More often than not, a good mixture of the two will win over either.
My friend plays a Kithkin deck and being they are all weenies until he begins pumping them up and making kithkin tokens. He doesn't lose very often with this deck unless I get a really good draw, or good timing on casts against him
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Posted 19 July 2010 at 06:52
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Setherial
349 posts
depends on the meta. If you play Type 2 there might not be any really good combos available and playing one might be stupid. Extended used to be a good place for combo (Hypergenesis and Valakut for instance. Hypergenesis was so good that they recently banned hypergenesis).
In Legacy (eternal format) ANT took the upper hand winning a lot of tournaments and dominating the top 8. It was a deck that could not be stopped, it could not be broken. It only failed when the combo pieces didn't fall into place. Recently they banned Mystical Tutor, and so breaking the ANT engine.
Combo is the most reliable deck type of them all. A good combo deck cannot be stopped and does not care about its life total. They can fall to 1 life and win. Aggro decks on the other hand (what you call the club) are far easier to break, control decks like aggro decks best.
It's far more difficult to try and control combo or other control decks.
Look at this deck for a good example of a very solid hard to break combo deck: Heartbeat Combo
the deck is in the middle of the article
Combo however is often the most difficult gametype to play and recuires a very good pilot to make it successful where Aggro is the easiest gametype to play.
cheers
Seth
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Posted 19 July 2010 at 07:26
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THC-Shrine
56 posts
[QUOTE=Seth]
Combo is the most reliable deck type of them all. A good combo deck cannot be stopped and does not care about its life total. They can fall to 1 life and win. Aggro decks on the other hand (what you call the club) are far easier to break, control decks like aggro decks best.
It's far more difficult to try and control combo or other control decks.[/QUOTE]
idk about that one man 90% of the time its aggro beats control, control beats combo, and combo beats aggro but you are right about the true blood combo decks the good ones cant be stopped, broken, beaten, torn down,or blown away like flash hulk or tooth & nail my personal fav combo decks:D
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Posted 19 July 2010 at 15:23
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Setherial
349 posts
aggro races, if it can outrace control and/or combo it will win. But even aggro decks turn into control decks to slow their opponents down and win that race. Take legacy goblins. Most decks run wastelands and some Rishedan Port. That's a lot of landhate for an aggro deck. And it works.
Bant runs Countertop soft lock to slow other decks down while it beats. Merfolk runs a denial strategy while it beats. Most successful aggro decks are control decks as well.
as for good combo decks, ANT could win turn one or turn two, that's impossible to outrace and it was damn hard to control. A turn one Dark Ritual followed by Sadistic Sacrament fucked them up nicely but they could sideboard around that. They played Orim's Chant against denial decks. It was just a pain in the ass deck. It didn't really guarentee a win (I know a very good player who played the deck) but you coudn't really stop it either.
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Posted 20 July 2010 at 07:37
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THC-Shrine
56 posts
i remimber back in mirrodin when tooth & nail was legal
ther was no deck out at the time that could stop it, atleast not where i played and kamigawa just made the deck even more rude with boseju when you cant counter the tooth and its pullin out reaturs like mephidross vampire and triskelion theres not much that can be done, combo decks ar the meanest of the breed but there is always a dcek or better player to stop it but every time i played my tooth it got me to the finals every time and i went home with my fnm card
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Posted 20 July 2010 at 23:28
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Zanmor
304 posts
Could you link to an ANT deck Seth? Searching it gets a thousand bant results and random nonsense but no ANT.
Guess I just need to refine my combos then. My friend does aggro, Chandra type stuff, and it usually beats me.
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Posted 21 July 2010 at 06:40
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Setherial
349 posts
[QUOTE=Zanmor]Could you link to an ANT deck Seth? Searching it gets a thousand bant results and random nonsense but no ANT.
Guess I just need to refine my combos then. My friend does aggro, Chandra type stuff, and it usually beats me.[/QUOTE]
here you go: http://www.deckcheck.net/deck.php?id=36020
if you do your own search look for Tendrils of Agony decks
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Posted 26 July 2010 at 08:39
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THC-Shrine
56 posts
ive seen those before but we never called them ant decks
we call them scepter chant in my circle
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Posted 26 July 2010 at 20:01
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Setherial
349 posts
[QUOTE=THC-Shrine]ive seen those before but we never called them ant decks
we call them scepter chant in my circle[/QUOTE]
In order to have a scepter chant deck you need to play isochron scepter which ant does not. Scepter Chant was a popular extended deck if I'm not mistaken, I've not really seen it in legacy. Then again I'm fairly new to legacy.
ANT stands for Ad Nauseam-Tendrils, and it kills by playing Tendrils of Agony. The reason it plays Orim's Chant is to prevent the combo from being countered once they go for it.
ANT is a very difficult deck to play, one miscalculation or mistake and you loose, there's also no guarantee you can actually combo out. Scepter Chant is just a stupid chant on a stick deck that can be easily broken by Krosan Grip or any other instant speed disenchant like effect like a Qasali Pridemage already on the board. I think there is a good reason I haven't seen it in legacy yet. It's just not that strong.
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Posted 27 July 2010 at 08:19
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