Discussion Forum

yes after the combat damage is asigned you can play a ability to return your wizard, so no damage will be dealt to your life and your wizard is safely in your hands...

How ever you need to do this before the damage resolves, if your wizard is destroyed or dealt lethal damage it is to late...

yea, unless it did something like that I really didnt see the point in this ability, thx Lex, appreciate the quick reply.

well it could also work great with a control card (you control target creature) and trickery charm, to remove your opponents "wizard" from the game.

Or in combination with a "when ... enters the battlefield ..." triggered ability card...so you could make that card enter the battle field again and again.....

I see what you mean, I guess Merchant of Secrets can work really well than.

Actually I have a following question for Riptide Lab now, if I sac a wizard for

Voidmage Prodigy, I cant return the sac'd wizard back to my

hand can I?

No...would be awsome though..

If you would return you wizard and the sac your wizard when the abilities resolve you would return it so you have nothing to sac...and the other way around if you return it and then sac'ed it when it resolves you would destroy your wizard and have nothing to return...

So that wouldn't work...

k, thank you for your answers.

Trying to make a mono tribal wizard deck and its not coming smoothly.....especially one without Patron Wizard seems like a suicide mission...lol

Anyways thx again for your time and effort.

[QUOTE=Lexusthegreat]yes after the combat damage is asigned you can play a ability to return your wizard, so no damage will be dealt to your life and your wizard is safely in your hands...

How ever you need to do this before the damage resolves, if your wizard is destroyed or dealt lethal damage it is to late...[/QUOTE]


actually no, the last time he could use this ability is in response to the blockers being declared, damage assignment happens past the point of no return.

awwwww.....

so this land ability is strictly for "when entering field" trigger wizards....

man onslaught is hard to work with when it comes to blues and wizards....

you can block with the wizard, then fast effect the land to get the wizard out of battle. no damage from the other creature and your wizard is safe

Or say they were to use pacifism on your wizard, return it to your hand then resummon it next chance

ok, so you CAN cheap block your way out with this land ability, and yea I guess if I wanted to remove any prexisting effects on a wizard, thats one way out too.

Thank you for your time.

[QUOTE=Seras]actually no, the last time he could use this ability is in response to the blockers being declared, damage assignment happens past the point of no return.[/QUOTE]

Say what? So if some dude declairs blockers then sac's its creature to power up another, my attacker (who "was" blocked by the creature just sac'ed) isn't blocked, and does damage to his life points?

Edit: Wait I didn't read the rest of the posts, and Now I am confused....Can you declare blockers, then sac/activate a ability to return you blocking creature, and still prevent damage and save your blocker (unless sac'ed obviously)??

Second edit: So I found the answer on a nother forum...So I guess that'll work...this opens up a load of new abilities....

[QUOTE=Lexusthegreat]Edit: Wait I didn't read the rest of the posts, and Now I am confused....Can you declare blockers, then sac/activate a ability to return you blocking creature, and still prevent damage and save your blocker (unless sac'ed obviously)??[/quote]

Alright, let's take all this one step at a time. See step 4 in particular.

506.1. The combat phase has five steps, which proceed in order: beginning of combat, declare attackers, declare blockers, combat damage, and end of combat. ...

Each player gets a chance to play instants and activated abilities during each of these five steps, after the initial business of the step.

Step 1: Beginning of Combat

Nothing happens, usually. Effects that happen "at the beginning of combat" go on the stack now. This is the defending player's last chance to use tap effects to keep an opponent's creature from attacking.

Step 2: Declare Attackers

The active player declares attackers. They become tapped.

Step 3: Declare Blockers

The defending player declares blockers. The creatures they block become blocked, and will remain blocked for the rest of combat, even if the blocking creature vanishes.

So, you could block with a Wizard now, and then in this same step bounce it with the Laboratory, and the creature it blocked will still be blocked and not be able to assign any combat damage to you (unless it has trample). Still, this is not the optimal time to do this trick; see below.

Step 4: Combat Damage EDIT: I got this part wrong; I failed to notice a big rules update; see Seras's post below.

Combat damage is assigned and goes on the stack. You can respond to this damage on the stack. This is the coolest time to bounce your blocker, because removing the blocker doesn't take its damage off the stack.

In other words, you attack me with an Elite Vanguard, and I block it with my Spellstutter Sprite. Then once combat damage is on the stack, I bounce my Sprite with the Laboratory. When combat damage eventually resolves, my Sprite is in my hand so the 2 damage from the Vanguard goes to waste, and your Vanguard dies from the 1 damage my Sprite left sitting on the stack.

That's how its done.

Step 5: End of Combat.

Nothing happens, usually. This step is for "at end of combat" abilities to trigger.

Wow, thank your for your detailed reponse, based on the phases within combat I guess its doable.

lol didnt think my question would end up with a thread like this.

k, */1 beware, wizardry will get you!

sorry but step 4 is definitely wrong, this was changed with the m10 rules clean up.

combat damage does not use the stack.

you can respond to step 3 but once that stack resolves then it's on to step 4 and nothing can be cast/activated until the damage resolves.

so, technically there is no step 5, just step 4 an additional resolvement of combat dmg melted into it, THAN we can activate instants and abilities?

http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/feature/42a number 5 covers it nicely

Egads!

Well, that does make sense. It was kind of odd for "damage" to go on the stack in that one instance but not in any others, and the trick I described above always was a tad unintuitive.

Hm. I'm going have to reread the rules...

[QUOTE=Seras]http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/feature/42a number 5 covers it nicely[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the article. Those are some well-done rules changes.

Jesus dudes, what a confusing pile of replies


Here is the summary

1. Opponent declares attackers and passes priority
2. You block with wizard and pass priority
3. Your opponent asks to go to damage and passes priority
4. You bounce your wizard and pass priority
5. Your opponent does not respond
6. We go to the damage step, the attacker was blocked but the blocker is gone. Unless the attacker has trample no damage is dealt by that creature. If the creature has trample full damage is done to player

Additional Info

- There's no such thing as damage on the stack (there used to be before M10)
- Riptide Laboratory is a useful card and is still played in legacy (tournaments). Lists like Faeries and Sumpreme Blue uses Riptide.