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double strike + argentum armor
if i have Kor Duelist and argentum armor attached to him, do i get to choose 2 things to destroy after i declare attack and before his attack hits? and if i have two argentum armors, is that 4 targets? it can also destroy Emrakul right?
ThePhanMan
2 posts
Posted 03 October 2010 at 05:24
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10 replies
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int0th3v0id
8 posts
You destroy one permanent. It's one target. And I think that would actually kill Emrakul. But your duelist would be killed also.
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Posted 03 October 2010 at 05:26
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LexustheGreat
3 posts
it's only one target you can destroy, and if you have two two..
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Posted 03 October 2010 at 06:18
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Jiggs
4 posts
the armors ability gives the creature +6/+6 and a annihilator-like effect. the difference is that the opponent does not sacrifice a permanent, instead you chose w/c permanent to destroy. so if you attack the duelist, the other ability triggers before declare blockers step so target the emrakul to destroy it. if you have 2 armors attached in play then you destroy 2 permanents.
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Posted 04 October 2010 at 00:10
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DavidF
40 posts
You can not destroy Emrakul with Kor Duelist and Argentum Armor, Emrakul has protection from colored spells and the creature Argentum Armor is attached to is white. Argentum Armor extends Kor Duelist to have "Whenever equipped creature attacks, destroy target permanent", making the ability on placed on the stack white.
Combat phase consist of 5 steps.
* Beginning of Combat Step
* Declare Attackers Step
* Declare Blockers Step
* Combat Damage Step
* End of Combat Step
Double and first strike affect the combat damage step, as this is split into 2 seperate steps - first creatures with first and double strike deal damage, then follows a regular damage step.
Argentum Armor say "Whenever equipped creature attacks [...]" meaning when you declare equiped creature as attacker in Declare Attackers Step.
As double strike allows the creature to deal combat damage in both the first strike and regular combat damage step, it does not allow you to declare the same creature as attacker in multiple declare attackers step - therefore you can destroy only one permanent each combat.
With this said - you can have Argentum Armor trigger multiple times if you have multiple combat phases, as with the card Relentless Assault.
And as previously stated - multiple attached Argentum Armor will trigger multiple times. (once for each copy of Argentum Armor)
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Posted 05 October 2010 at 07:01
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Setherial
349 posts
[QUOTE=DavidF]You can not destroy Emrakul with Kor Duelist and Argentum Armor, Emrakul has protection from colored spells and the creature Argentum Armor is attached to is white. Argentum Armor extends Kor Duelist to have "Whenever equipped creature attacks, destroy target permanent", making the ability on placed on the stack white.[/QUOTE]
This is totally incorrect!!
- Emrakul has protection from spells not permanents and when an equipped creature with Argentum Armor attacks Emrakul is targetted by a permanent and not a spell so his protection isn't at all relevant.
- The destroy effect on Argentum Armor is not past on to the creature, it is a triggered effect from the equipment, this effect is colorless and not white like the above poster claimed
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Posted 05 October 2010 at 08:22
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Jiggs
4 posts
i agree with seth : )
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Posted 06 October 2010 at 03:07
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int0th3v0id
8 posts
[QUOTE=DavidF]You can not destroy Emrakul with Kor Duelist and Argentum Armor, Emrakul has protection from colored spells and the creature Argentum Armor is attached to is white. Argentum Armor extends Kor Duelist to have "Whenever equipped creature attacks, destroy target permanent", making the ability on placed on the stack white.
Combat phase consist of 5 steps.
* Beginning of Combat Step
* Declare Attackers Step
* Declare Blockers Step
* Combat Damage Step
* End of Combat Step
Double and first strike affect the combat damage step, as this is split into 2 seperate steps - first creatures with first and double strike deal damage, then follows a regular damage step.
Argentum Armor say "Whenever equipped creature attacks [...]" meaning when you declare equiped creature as attacker in Declare Attackers Step.
As double strike allows the creature to deal combat damage in both the first strike and regular combat damage step, it does not allow you to declare the same creature as attacker in multiple declare attackers step - therefore you can destroy only one permanent each combat.
With this said - you can have Argentum Armor trigger multiple times if you have multiple combat phases, as with the card Relentless Assault.
And as previously stated - multiple attached Argentum Armor will trigger multiple times. (once for each copy of Argentum Armor)[/QUOTE]
However, once on the field, Kor Duelist is no longer a spell, therefore uneffected by Protection. Perhaps it's a colored ability, but it's no longer a spell and Emrakul's Protection capabilities don't come into play. Both creatures would be destroyed.
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Posted 06 October 2010 at 05:16
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ThePhanMan
2 posts
i dont know how ur getting the idea kor duelist and Emrakul are both gonna die some how
a creature with protection from a color doesnt die from lethal damage, like blocking or being blocked by a more powerful creature, it also makes creatures of a color not be able to block the protected creature and protection also makes that creature not targetable by spells of that color
duelist cant block emrakul since its got protection from white and the other colors, it also has flying, im saying the argentum armor is colorless so i can target and kill emrakul if i declare attack and use its ability like using a Umezawa's Jitte with 15 counters on it
then again emrakul does say protection from colored spells instead of protection from all colors, i guess that means oblivion ring would work on it :confused:
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Posted 06 October 2010 at 16:17
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Bonzai820
55 posts
The duelist doesn't die if you target Emrakul with the ability of the Armor, but it does die if you target something else and Emrakul blocks the attacking duelist
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Posted 06 October 2010 at 19:11
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Safearus
29 posts
[QUOTE=Bonzai820]The duelist doesn't die if you target Emrakul with the ability of the Armor, but it does die if you target something else and Emrakul blocks the attacking duelist[/QUOTE]
+1
This is definately the case.
And I agree with Seth on the earlier mentioned comment aswell.
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Posted 07 October 2010 at 04:03
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