Discussion Forum

Any feedback at all would be good

A lot of work needs to be done with your deck. It'd almost be easier to start from scratch :/

First and formost you need to get rid of the 'Hinterland Harbor's. You don't use Green mana at all in your deck and therefore don't need that dual land.
Also you should have around 20 land in your deck. Can't do anything if you have no land to create mana. (Look into getting Nephalia Drownyards)

Second, almost all of your artifacts need to be removed. They serve little to no purpose in your mill deck and are just slowing your deck down.

Third, you have almost no direct mill spells. Add some.

Forth, you should think over your creatures again (more than likely getting rid of the ones you have for better ones).
Look into getting a playset of 'Hedron Crab's and 'Lich Lord of Unx's

There that should be enough advice for now. Come back when you've made some serious changes and I'll be happy to look over your deck again :)

Luck!

So ive changed the deck up quite abit.
It feels like it cant hold against anything though.
here, have a link: http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=269569

Thank you for helping me!

//dentalman

A little better.

You should take out the Venser's Journals since you wont have more than 7 cards in your hand with all the low cost spells in your deck.
(meaning you'll be able to play SOMETHING every turn, plus only about a 10th of your deck are draw spells)

It looks as if your trying to do a slow, round-about way of milling someone with your deck through a Jace's Erasure + Arcivist + Venser's Journal. While it's a pretty strong combo - it also takes awhile to set up. Milling is more about consistently making your opponent get rid of cards, not about making him discard his deck all at once on the last turn.

Take a look at my deck challenge mill deck. It's more or less how mill should be built (obviously with more creatures though - was part of challenge to have only 1)

http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=271207

Link: http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=269569

So i took your advise on getting more consistent milling and decided to put in Dream Twist and Tome Scour. I dont know if there are better verisions of those cards that i may use, so please tell if there are!
It also feels like i should have Visions of Beyond in there, but for now ill use Jace's Archivist to draw new cards when im out of them. Ive acctually won games with Jace's Archivist by drawing counterspells on my opponents turn ^^

This still feels like a very unfinished deck, and i dont know what to add/remove.

Thanks again

//dentalman

The deck is looking a LOT better now.

Some more cards for you to consider are

Memory Sluice, and Sanity Grinding.

Another creature to consider too is Grimoire Thief


You can play Memory Sluice with either U or B mana and is a VERY VERY nice card.

Sanity Grinding would be a nice addition since your mono U and have a good chance to mill 10 or more cards with it.

Grimoire Thief mills 3 cards to Exile every time it's tapped and can sacrifice it to counter any spell that shares a name with a card that it milled.

Of the spells you have in the deck the first I'd get rid of are "Preordain", but I also dislike the spell and see no real use for it. (in other words it's just my personal oppinion hehe) :)

So what i did was swap out 2 Preordain for 2 Mana Leaks because i felt it lacked controll (hey, im :manau:) ^^. As for why swaping those cards, controlling your own draws (which i love to do) is the most reasonable thing to remove. I had 8 cards that controlled what my next draw will be, it feels to be abit much. Maybe i can remove 2 lands and keep the Preordains, i mean i can just see to it that i draw a land when i want to?

As for why i didnt include Memory Sluice and Sanity Grinding. One thing they have in common is that they are both sorceries, so you cant save up for conterspells as easily.
Memory Sluice i feel like its only good when you can tap two creatures, and i feel that i cant afford to do that with 12 of them in my deck (of which 4 is to use their ability where you tap them). I Could get rid of Jace's Archivist and add Grimoire Theif, but it feels like i will tap them too rarely with only that combo, and also i dont get to draw new cards when i need to. Tell me if im wrong!
Then we have Sanity Grinding which im sure is an awsome card but 2/3 of my deck has cmc of 1 or lower (1/3 1 cmc and 1/3 0 cmc), so you can expect to mill maybe 5-8 cards with it. This makes me feel that it wont be worth casting a spell on my turn that costs 3 mana.
I chose Dream Twist because its an instant, so im goin to keep that one. As for tome scour, i dont know.

I feel that in this deck Grimoire Thief will just die whenever i try to tap him (by attacking) so i didnt put him in there, although, his counterspell while being a miller and a attacker/blocker seems really nice. Maybe theres another way to tap him continously? (other than whats mentioned above obvioulsy)

And why the hate on Preordain? Is there something ive missed about that card? its an awsome card to controll what you draw! (even though i feel that Ponder is better). I really want to get Dissipation Field and to have atleast one counterspell on my hand at all times and thats why they are there.

Tell me what you think of how i think, is it correct to be thinking like this?
Thinkception! had to be said.

Anyway Thank you soo much for helping me! <3

//dentalman

PS. I have other deck that i need help on too if you want to you can check them out too :P Im sorry of this bothers you.

Links:
http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=251658
http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=272375 (^these are the same deck, just remade)

Actually there is a way to tap Grimoire Theif without attacking now that you mention it.

It's an enchantment called "Freed from the Real" and with enough mana you can continuously tap and untap it.

You could also use "Writ of Passage" to make it unblockable. :)

You actually have some good points on not including those cards. I was merely bringing them to your attention :)

As for preordain hate on my part. I don't see the usefullness in Scry 2. If it were scry 3-5 it'd be a different story, but 2? eh not as shiny as other more effective cards. This is just my opinion though.


Edit: Another Card you should consider is "Snapcaster Mage" he'll give a spell in your graveyard flashback when he comes into play so you can double-dip on Tome Scour, Ponder, or any of your counter spells on the spot.

Okay, this is what i did:
I removed Jace's Archivist and two Islands for Grimoire Thief and Freed from the Real. I also removed Tome Scour for Memory Sluice. It feels more secure to add Grimoire Thief when you have a guarantee to tap him (also, this is a great mana dump when you have nothing to counterspell and therefore eases the need to constantly draw cards) and as mentioned before, a great combo with Memory Sluice and Grimoire Thief.

I removed two Mana Leak to add Preordain. This because Grimoire Thief is a counterspell escetially (in addition to being a blocker and a miller).

Should i add something else instead of Preordain? and in that case what do you think? I really feel that i need to have at least six cards that controll what i draw, so i can constantly have counterspells and get things like Freed from the Real and Dissipation Field.

Are there better cards that scry than Preordain? I mean for one mana you keep your card advantage and you get to look att the top two cards and put them on the bottom if you dont need them.

Ive put a couple of cards in the sideboard which im considering putting in, including Snapcaster Mage.
Although Snapcaster Mage is a good card i dont know if it fits in. What should i remove to put it in? The only thing i can think of is Spellskite, but that card is soo awsome... I like the idea though!

Crystal ball is a replacement for Preodain since you still keep your card advantage (well you loose one card for one turn) and you get scry as an instant. I think this might make it in the deck instead. The only bad thing is that it costs :mana3: to get out which is quite expensive when you want to have mana for counterspells.

Im also considering Think Twice as a subsitute for Preordain and thats because its another instant and you may cast it twice. Just a good card in general imo if you go for the counterspell route.

[QUOTE]You actually have some good points on not including those cards. I was merely bringing them to your attention

-Tallyaeon[/QUOTE]

If you felt hit by the things i stated, i didnt mean anything towards you :D Just explaining the thoughts about the cards.

Im quite new to Magic and i dont know that many cards and i really need help to find those older cards that are good, is there any site you can check them (i mean besides from the official Magic site)?.

Thanks once again! <3

//dentalman

Oh no, don't worry you made some rather good points. :)

and looks like your deck is coming along nicely. I was going to suggest something I remembered last night, but looking at it today. It wouldn't fit in your deck too well.

Mindshrieker see.

Anyways time for my shift. ^.^

As for other Scry suggestions (now that I have some time)

"Mystic Speculation" is a good one, and better than Preordain.

It allows you to Scry 3 and has a Buy back cost of :mana2: so if you have the mana you can play it however many turns in a row you want to. :)


Oh and there's a good trick to finding cards on the mtgvault database.
When doing a search click "Card Text" option and then put the effect you want into the search query and it will list all cards with that text in the results.

ex: Putting "Scry" in the search (with card text selected) will show you all cards with Scry on the card. It's really handy for finding specific effect cards, rather than spending hours shifting through the entire collection. lol

Hope this helps.

Okay, ive tried out Crytal Ball in another deck and its really good if you can get it out, with an emphasis on if in this deck (i feel controll etc. is essential for this deck).

So i removed the 4 Preordains and added 3 Crystal Balls and 1 more Mana Leak. I still want to try Preordain since i prefer it over the other cmc :mana1: scry (you dont loose card advantage which in my eyes is important for blue decks).

I will try both of the variants of this deck very soon, if you dont have anything more to say about it? If a card have high cmc (more than :mana2:) i want it to be an instant so you can drop it at their end step so nothing gets in the way of your counter spells.

Thank you soo much for everything <3
The Card text search really helps :P

/dentalman