Discussion Forum

trournament tip:

- never play surgical extraction main

thoughts about the deck:

- Dungrove Elder is not a very impressive creature
- 6 birds of paradise seems like too much, your deck will run out of gas fast
- Good options to concider are Rancor and Thalia
- 4x Shield of the Oversoul seems like to much
- Have you concidered playing Sovereigns of Lost Alara combo with Eldrazi Conscription? I played and won a tournament playing them when Modern first appeared as a format. I played Lotus Cobra to get to enough mana on turn 3 to play them and attack with a 14/12 trampling Cobra the same turn. Ofcourse this was when GSZ was still legal.

thanks, seth! i side-decked the surgical extractions. you're absolutely right about the birds and noble hierarchs, but i need the mana spread right now until i can get my new shock lands. but it does fizzle sometimes!! it's frustrating.

should i replace the dungroves with gaddock, or something else? whadaya think?

i made quite a few changes. seth, if you or anyone else would like to check it out and lemme know what you think, i'd really appreciate it!

Artifacts
2x Tidehollow Sculler
3x Spellskite

Creatures
4x Treefolk Harbinger
3x Doran, the Siege Tower
1x Rafiq of the Many
4x Noble Hierarch
3x Knight of the Reliquary
3x Qasali Pridemage

Enchantments
3x Shield of the Oversoul

Land
1x Overgrown Tomb
1x Temple Garden
1x Breeding Pool
4x Murmuring Bosk
1x Treetop Village
2x Marsh Flats
4x Verdant Catacombs
2x Stirring Wildwood
1x Woodland Cemetery
1x Sunpetal Grove
1x Plains
2x Swamp
2x Forest

Planeswalkers
1x Elspeth, Knight-Errant

Spells
1x Nameless Inversion
1x Thoughtseize
3x Path to Exile
3x Maelstrom Pulse
2x Inquisition of Kozilek



any suggestions on the lands? or anything else?

I revamped it a little

3x Spellskite
3x Lotus Cobra
2x Rafiq of the Many
4x Noble Hierarch
4x Knight of the Reliquary
4x Qasali Pridemage
2x Baneslayer Angel

2x Shield of the Oversoul
3x Rancor

1x Overgrown Tomb
2x Temple Garden
1x Breeding Pool
1x Treetop Village
1x Treetop Village
1x Marsh Flats
3x Mysty Rainforest
4x Verdant Catacombs
1x Woodland Cemetery
2x Sunpetal Grove
1x Plains
2x Swamp
2x Forest

2x Elspeth, Knight-Errant

2x Thoughtseize
3x Path to Exile
2x Maelstrom Pulse
2x Inquisition of Kozilek


If you take it to a tournament I would add more discard to the sideboard, a few extractions and probably the Tidehollow Scullers I removed as they are good in a combo matchup.

should i just switch to bant? :(

If rafiq is the only blue spell you are playing you can easily get away with a GWBu build in Modern.

that's good to know. i was wondering if my four colors (although one is barely present) would be frowned upon.
but i guess i should elaborate. i have almost everything i need to make a bant aggro deck, i have misty rainforests and i only need a couple more geist of saint traft, and the rest would be pretty easy to get. which deck usually fares better? they're pretty similiar it seems. bant has counterspells instead of disruption, and some of the creatures are different, but for the most part they look the same. or atleast they appear that way to me. so which do you think i'd be better off playing as far as winning tournaments is concerned?

Well I'm no Modern expert, I'm more of a legacy tournament player but the only reason people don't play 4 or 5 color control in legacy is because there is wasteland and stifle. Modern these days from what I've seen doesn't bother with land disruption so the only thing that prevents you from going nuts is the damage you take from your own shocklands and fetchlands.

You obviously don't want to crack, fetch, take 2 from a shockland, play thoughtseize take another 2 and go (setting yourself at 15 life turn 1 before the other guy did anything). So it's still reasonable to devide your deck build in early/mid and late game color requirements and minimize the damage you need to take early on from your own landbase. The 1 blue for instance in your deck doesn't really impact the deck much so you're fine.

As for what is better, Bant or Rock, I dunno. In legacy Bant is far superior but there you have far more powerful blue spells. In modern you just want to beat down hard without loosing from combo, both discard and spellpierce/mana leak are good in that respect but both mean tempo loss for your deck. Personally I would stick to discard I think, but again playing :manaw::manag::manab: as main colors and dipping :manau: for Rafiq is perfectly reasonable.

I think the new set will have a big impact on what to play. Abrubt decay for instance is nuts in legacy and will probably be very good in Modern as well and is a good reason to stick to playing :manab:. The bottom line however is that :manaw::manag: are the most important aggro colors. They give you Qasali Pridemage, Knight of the Reliquary, Tarmogoyf, Noble Hierarch, Rancor, maybe the new Loxodon Smiter etc...

On the subject of Bant, take a look at this legacy deck
http://www.mtgdecks.net/decks/view/37209

Although Force of Will and Daze play a big role I do think there is potential here for a Modern build. Might give you some ideas. The basic idea is to give evasion to Geist of Saint Traft either with Aven Mimeomancer or with Spectral Flight and then boosting it with Exalted triggers (4 Qasali Pridemage
and 4 Noble Hierarch). Aven Mimeomancer also makes your birds and noble hierarchs into 3/1 flyers which is pretty nice :)

thanks! a lot of good info there. i bought a booster box today and pulled some cool stuff, including a couple of those loxodon smiters. those guys are pretty sick. may have to use em. i also picked up a couple more geist of saint traft, and ordered the rest of the cards i needed for a bant deck. i'm thinking i'm just gonna switch back and forth between the two, since they'll use a lot of the same cards. whatever tickles my fancy at the time, ya know?

i ordered those sovereigns of lost alara, a couple of cobras, and i already had the eldrazi conscriptions. i liked that idea, may go that route. i also ordered a play set of mimeomancers. may decide to go that route.

also, i was thinking... what about dauntless escorts and some supreme verdicts (i pulled a couple today) for the bant deck? good idea or do you think the space could be better used for something else?

again, thanks for all your input

p.s. why don't i see rafiq in any tourny bant decks? he seems good... is it because he's lightning bolt fodder or what? something i'm missing?

I think the Loxodon smiters might be pretty good indeed depending on how counterspell/discard heavy the meta game is. Against UR Delver they seem pretty hardcore (just out of reach of lightning bolt and uncounterable). Against The Rack decks they seem good as well. That said staples like a Tarmogoyf or Knight of the Reliquary will almost always be bigger. They do work well with Shield of the Oversoul. Turn 1 Noble Hierarch, turn 2 Loxodon smiter, turn 3 Shield and attack with a 7/7 flying indestructable while holding a mana open for lets say spell pierce.

As for rafiq I don't think there is anything really holding playing him back, I'm sure if someone plays him and wins a big tournament everyone starts playing him, tournament formats are weird like that. Noone plays a seemingly good card because nonone plays it and then someone does and overnight everyone wants that card and prices shoot up. Happens all the time.