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there are a few very simple ideas to this deck. 1: stabbing pain to get my infect creatures past early game defenders 2: very cheap infect creatures, this will allow me to have a creature out turn 2 almost every time. 3: + spells. giant growths for well just straight dmg/ survive making for quick very precise infect/ poison counters. 4:Livewire Lash. mixed with the infect creatures and virulent swipe/ prey's vengeance. both spells with rebound. making it so that if the creature is to be targeted by an opponent's spell it will give that opponent 2 poison counters, and since the 2 mentioned spells have rebound i can target the creature 2 times with each spell so in theory i will be killing people with out ever even having to attack with the creature. with only having 2 mana i can do everything in this deck with the exception of hand of the praetors but that is not to great of a deal because if they get out the game Will be over very soon after words. with 2 mana i can have a infect creature out w/ livewire lash equiped and ready to go by turn 3. by turn 4 i will have atleast 2, maybe 3, of my instant spells in hand and being played. making it so that it is 4 poison that is not able to be blocked with the only exception of safe passage. any suggestions send them please always looking to improve it. (pls standard only)
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awesome deck especailly with the livewire lash combo you got going it looks awesome ive been wanting to making a infect deck kinda like this but instead of stabbing pain i would put some removal like doomblade or something but this looks good
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stabbing pain is not a removal, its the ability to take down a blocker so your infect damage can get through. Doom blade is unreliable in doing so because almost 40 percent plus of people that play in tournaments play black, also it costs 2 to cast which takes away from the double boost. Panic spell bomb is also great because of its 1 drop first turn which eliminates a blocker also.
Why not use Groundswell? Seems like Black isn't doing much for this deck. Have you thought about cutting it all together for Blue? Blue would give you Distortion Strike as well as giving you Spell Pierce / Negate / Mana Leak to help stop removal / Fog. I guess Swipe's +2/+0 and it's rebound helps, but seems like protection would be better if you also get a spell that does the job of both Pain and Swipe at the same time. I just posted a similar (in theory) list. Only instead of comboing cheap creatures + Livewire + pump spells, I opted of a ramp package to power out the "bigger" infect creatures out on turn 3/4 and swing in and try to use a few pump spells to get a OHKO. Here's the link to my build: http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=131363
Am i miss reading something here but wouldn't limewire lash just deal normal damage to your opponent after being the target of a spell instead of giving poison counters?
Lash gives the creature the ability to deal damage to a creature or player when the equipped creature is targeted by a spell/ability. Since the creature is the source, it'll deal out poison counters as long as the creature has infect.
Hmmm Putrefax and maybe some mana ramp. You have green aft6er all whats a few cards here and there to utilize a colors specialties? Explore or cultivate perhaps. explore you'd need more than just 20 land to be effective often enough otherwise its just a draw card. cultivate is two guanateed lands which will help you out emensly. I also think you should replace stabbing pain with doom blade. or at least side it in.
thanks for the comments guys. doom blade seems like a very popular subject, the reason i didnt put it in the list is because it kills the creature it targets. and of coarse thats y everyone wants it right? of coarse. my spell selection makes it so that Every one of my spells are able to target my creature with livewire lash and not destroy it. for example. i can have my ichorclaw myr out and he is equipped with my lash. if no creatures are able to block due to any reason maybe a stabbing pain, i attack pump it then at the end hit it with a stabbing pain not killing it but still 2 more dmg as for ramp up into the bigger infect creatures i see no point in that considering if played properly i should have won by the time i have that much mana out.
i may add 4 verdant catacombs yes or no Green Black fetch land
Definitely, though you might want to look into bringing your land count to 22. 20 seems a little light, even if you only really need 2 mana.
ya i thought about that but the only thing that i would take out to make room for the 2 extra land would be the giant growths and those can be game enders with this deck
garruk would be a nice choice for this deck. it gives you another win condition with his overrun and his +1 is always helpfull
I think it might be too slow. with this you either win turn 3-6. Any longer you lose.
People keep saying doom blade. Why? If anything you should replace it with vendetta. Great card and you can use the extra 1 mana. It works since your deck is so fast. Let alone that as long as they don't get huge creatures out, you won't lose much life. just don't run against black.
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Vendetta is the BEST choice for this type of deck for straight removal
1st I want to thank you for this deck idea! I am really needing budget decks so I am weighing in here with a few budget saving ideas. I know HoPis really solid but it is pricey so I took those out and replaced them with 2 ichor Rats and 2 Corpse Curs (not sure the value but I already owned them) Also instead of verdant catacombs I am using Golgari Rot farm and or Golgari Signet I was able to build this deck with my edits for under $10. That is solid!
my buddy has a wither deck set up and kulrath knight (3 r/b r/b, 3/3 flyer wither, creatures your opponents control with counters on them can't attack or block) is really annoying, even if you get creatures out to block they are only good for one turn, might give the deck a bit more sustain if the game starts to carry out, maybe replace the tangle anglers
I haven't actually looked through the comments to see if any of this has already been suggested, but I would really think like 2 more land would smooth things out a bit more. After that, Disfigure really seems a lot better than Stabbing Pain for most situations. Also, Necropede is a really great 2-drop infect guy for a better likelihood of that explosive turn 3 or 4 win. To get it to be a turn 3 win easier, I'd suggest Groundswell also. Once you get to 2 mana, don't crack your fetches until you really need the mana - this will allow you to groundswell big whenever you need/want (even on your opponents turn).
I like how you say unstoppable so mnay people including me have ecks like this that are so easy to beat red burn just wreks infect decks plus this one is not even that good. Canopy cover is suha good card for infect so ur creatures dont get burned. Cystbearer is also better than tangle angler and blight mamba
i agree live wire lash is shit when compared to an early assault strobe with giant growth
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i was actually looking at the deck some more, some sort of removal would be helpful, lately i've been running this deck http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=120163 with guard gomazoa (1/3 flying defender, prevent all combat damage that would be dealt to guard gomazoa), anything like that could slow the deck down a lot
Just a suggestion, but perhaps instead of Virulent Swipe you could potentially add Vampire's Bite instead. Virulent Swipe gives +2/0 and Deathtouch, which is great. On the other hand, Vampire's Bite gives +3/0 (and a kicker ability that you'd be unlikely to use). With an infect deck and a ton of buffs, deathtouch doesn't seem that important. It's very rare that you'd suicide an infect creature using deathtouch in this deck, as you need to keep them alive early in the game to quickly overwhelm your opponent. Chances are, you're going to be saving your creatures with Giant Growth/Prey's Vengeance. Whenever you'd use Virulent Swipe, chances are you're simply going for extra poison counters, rather then support with fighting creatures. As much as the extra +1/0 doesn't seem useful, there are multiple ocassions, especially if you're trying for +10 poison counters in one attack, where the extra one will make a difference. Consider this scenario, it's turn three and you currently have plague stinger out along with 1 swamp and 1 forest. You play a forest, and then attack. Your opponent takes the attack, and then you tap for Vampire's Bite/Giant Growth/Giant Growth. In total, (1+3/3+3/3+3), you've just dealt exactly 10 poison counters. If you play with Virulent Swipe, that'll only be 9 poison counters. Once again, typically if your infect blocks/fights another creature, chances are you'll need to keep your own creature alive, so you'll have to use buffs that add to toughness, which makes Virulent Swipe useless. Stabbing Pain is a great idea. I was thinking about Disfigure (-2/-2 until the end of turn) to clear out creatures. However, Stabbing Pain is great for clearing 1/1, and it also has the tap ability which'll catch your opponent off-guard. Definitely, good job on that addition, as an infect deck such as this one is all about catching your opponent off-guard and attacking for maximum damage. I'm not really sure about the Tangler Angler. It's a great infect card, but better played with blue/control. You're running a deck to relies on cheap creatures to take out your opponent with buffs. Besides being too costly, especially since there are four of them in the deck, it doesn't commit enough damage and its ability is contrary to your goal. Rather then forcing creatures to block, you should concern yourself with bypassing them entirely. If you spend too much time using your creatures to block/attack other creatures, you'll find yourself wasting buffs and allowing your opponent to gain mana and use more complex spells. Maybe try swapping the Anglers out for Necropedes? Besides being cheap and reliable, these creatures will allow you to put a -1/-1 on anything you'd like upon death. This means you can kill a 1/1, or kill a 2/2 if you blocked it with the Necropede. Since you're running with multiple Hand of the Praetors, it's best to have as many cheap infect as possible in order to keep the advantage of its effects. It also might be best to run with 4 Giant Growths. The +3/+3 is useful for dealing poison counters as well as countering Lightning Bolt or creature attacks. Besides an offensive buff, it is essentially your control/counter. Maybe exchange 1 Prey's Vengeance/1 Vines of Vastwood for 2 Giant Growths? Or just exchange 2 Vines of Vastwood for 2 Giant Growths. I find that the +4/+4 effect of Vastwood is great, but sometimes too costly when you could have paid 1 for +3/3, and it's main ability doesn't exactly counter too many things and seems to be situational. I also like Prey's Vengeance, but for a burst deck it can ocassionaly lack, and sometimes when it rebounds you have nothing to put it on or have no use for it during that turn. Still, I think at least 3 is worth having. Anyhow, feel free to disregard this advice, that's all it is anyhow, just a few things you might want to think about when tuning your deck. I've played with a similar type of deck, and after testing it, those are the things I've noticed. Someone mentione Garruk, and although I've yet to test it, it might be worthwhile for your sideboard. Whenever you play against control decks, the chance of the game lasting longer will increase, and that is where Garruk will shine. You're correct to note it's too slow, but when forced to play a slow game, it'll be useful. For four mana, you essentially regain 2. And the following turn, that 4 mana can become 6. Or, if you choose his final ability, on the Garruk's second turn you can give your infect +3/+3 and trample. As long as your opponent doesn't have a non-damage counter available, you can just toss out a few more buffs and you win. Even if they have a counter ready, if you've got more then 1 creature, you'll still likely be fine.
Some people will definitely disagree with this. I would actually consider replacing a swamp with a third Giant Growth. As is, the deck is evenly split between green and black cards. With the addition of another Giant Growth, it would swing slightly to green > black. With so many one and two casting cost cards in the deck, I believe you could actually go a little light on lands. I like the black/green fetch lands, they help lower the chance of drawing land when you want to draw something like, oh I dunno, Giant Growth. Other than that, I wouldn't change a thing. I see several people suggesting going to 22 land cards. I think for a deck such as this one with such a low mana curve, going to 22 lands would weaken it.
I don't think you'd follow my suggestion but my friend and I have found that gigantaform is a great late-game winner.
if you play tainted strike on a creature with livewire lash the damage from the lash will happen before the tainted strike resolves
i run a very similar build to this deck. In my opinion, i really like birds of paradise, it really speeds this deck up, also, add necropede instead of blight mamba. Add two putrefax for the tangle angle, he's been a late game ender with control for me. I also prefer more pump spells then you, I run 4 giant growths, 4 prey's vengeance, 4 groundswells, 4 vines, and instead of stabbing pain i run disfigure, most early blockers are 2/2 etc. also 1 less livewire lash. It works extremely well and I've beat many tier 1 decks with it. I've play-tested it at a lot of events, and it's fairly consistent. The birds of paradise really help a lot.
I was about to make the exact same comment, if you check my infect deck (which I like to think is pretty good) I use BoP and it not only accelerates my mana, but allows me to splash blue while only having to islands and 2 u/b duals. I agree that putrefax should be a sideboard for control. I've never played with livewire lash, but maybe I will...
that is actually pretty easy to stop two lightning bolts and a counterspell are realy all you need to blunt the majority of this decks opening hit and then after the opening you really have nothing left
That is true, if your opponent knows what to expect, they can mulligan once to ensure they get a few of those spells. In that case, you'd essentially have to play with wit, opposed to countering with cards. You'd have to focus on pushing as many creatures onto the field as possible in the first few turns. I believe in the next block there is a 1 Mana creature with infect, which will make this possible. The more creatures you can throw out, the faster you can waste their counters. Finally, when attacking, beware of how much mana they have available to spend. If they've got at least 1 red mana, it's possible after buffing your creature they'll toss a lightning bolt. The bolt would be established first, thus ruining your entire plan. Also, they could toss out unsummon or a damage reducing card, which would have the same result. If they have mana available, attack, but use the weaker buffs, or no buffs at all, in order to encourage them to waste these spells. Thankfully, unless the mulligan rule is loose, they will not have their ideal hand to counter everything you can do.
I know this suggestion is pretty budget unfriendly but you could always throw in some ink moth nexus
how about you get rid of blighted manba for blighted agent and add another couple giant growth
You should add Tooth and Nail to your sideboard so you can get Emrakul out cheaper.
I feel that this deck is essentially made for aggro. Hand of the Praetors is a great card for this deck, but I feel that it may slow things down a bit, and I feel the same about Tangle Anger. Personally, I would try pulling all six of those cards, and replacing them with 2 Glistener Elf and 4 Mutagenic Growth to maximize your damage in the first few turns. Just my two cents.
Overgrown Tomb should help with the mana, plus you want blue for counterspells my dude. All of your threats die to fatal push/bolt/path. And Collected company decks should just run you down. I can't really see this deck working very well in modern tournaments because of how flimsy it is. I can understand that you are trying to put more infect creatures into the deck to make it "better", but it is just going to mess with your speed. If you can't go off till turn 3 normally, then you should just play zoo or death's shadow since they can just dump their hands early on. Also, control decks will just tear you apart when you try to combo off since you rely on resolving every single pump spell. I you are gonna keep it G/B you need Mutagenic Growth, Fatal Push, and maybe a dismember.