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Cascade. Into Hypergenesus. Into win. Cascade means "When you cast this spell, exile cards from the top of your library until you exile a nonland card that costs less. You may play it without paying its mana cost. Put the exiled cards on the bottom in a random order. Since Hypergenesis has no mana cost, its CMC is 0. Thus cascade hits it and allows you to cast it.
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:O You broke my mind dude, this is insane.
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About time someone noticed :P Yea, this is pretty cool IMHO...
It's kind of awesome, I have never seen something pump creatures like this faster than Reanimator before, not even Sneak & Tell! If you ever run this at some sort of tourney, I would love some results. It looks like it SHOULD actually be a very viable deck right now, but who knows how the meta's going to be shaped in a month... It might even be shaped around this, I mean holy crap...
The real challenge is balancing protection and Fatties. Youll notice I picked most blue dudes so I can pitch a fatty if I have to. The nice thing is the mondo built-in resilliency. Counter one Storm and I just wait to draw another! Any ideas to speed it up? Id like it to be a bit faster on average
From what I've seen off of test hands the problem isn't speed, this thing can fire off turn two or three if it has what it needs, I think the only thing that really needs worked on is consistency. I don't know how you can really speed it up, it works because the ONLY thing you can cascade into is Hypergenesis, and all of the best of cards to speed boost are already here... Speed is pretty much at peek levels.
Ahhhh, thinking before typing is a good thing... I meant I wanted to increasethe average speed (ie consistency) of the deck lols. Do you think many another cascade would help? I don't think any lands produce 2 colored mana, do they? Except the ones that cost a mana to use i mean...
WhiteAndBlueTheyKillYou has deleted this comment.
I can't think of anything for consistency, I'd have to play the deck to figure that out and I don't have the cards to do that. Awesome deck though :D Only way I see this having trouble is Hyper being countered or the opponent having worse threats than you :p
dude you need to put in elvish piper
Time to start my Piper hate (again)... ahem... Piper won't work in this deck, it dies before it can be of any use. Blue has counter and bounce, black has kill, white has exile, red has burn. The only colour that can't do anything about it is green... no, green has kill too in the form of cards like Beast Within. So although Piper is good on paper, in practice it's not.
white has instant protect spells that can keep it alive.
Piper is interesting, but not a good card in this deck. It just dilutes the main engine, is slow, and has no protection. Instant speed white protection is a really bad MD option because its so narrow, but even better cards still cause an even greater dilution of the purpose of the deck. I think I'll pass.
Agreed, piper doesn' work in this deck, but the 'piper doesn't work at all' hate isnt warrented. There are a multitude of ways to protect it, and in all honesty it only really needs 1 turn and the right card to ruin someone's day. It however will do badly on its own and needs to be in a deck full of protection, fatties, and other options like quicksilver amulet. it is a good card, it just needs a good deck to support it.
Nice deck but Emrakul, the Aeons Torn's casting ability will not kick in because he was not casted he was put into play. But it shouldn't really matter although it would be nice to take another turn after summoning the forces.
Meh, I really care not. Odds are you will have multiple guys on the table, so a single swing will win. Yes, wrath effects might be a pain, but you have counterspells, and they need to have a wrath that turn or they die. Plus, since Outburst is an instant, I can do it EOT :) Thanks for the comment! Check out some of my other decks too
just be careful to remmember emrakul's wording on his protection does not work on abilties. You may already know this, but oblivion ring esq spells and creature abilties will penetrate it.
very nice deck, the only thing I would change is the number of Legendary creatures you have. I'd cut them down to a 1 of or maybe a 2 of instead of having 4 of them. in sample hands I had the best starting hand where I could play cascade but had 2 of the same legendary creature in hand so they would just cancel each other. :( maybe see about adding some of the blue cards that let you draw a card and then put one back on top or put 2 back would help as well... that is if you don't want to change the number of legendary creatures your running.
hey what would happen if you put in some cards that had abilites that triggerd when they entered the battle field. such as sun titan or prime evil? wouldn't maybe a one of those be worth it? I'm sure there could be something that could combo really well here. :)
please disregard the above comment about the legendary creatures, I didn't catch that Hypergenesis says "may". *puts dunce cap on* I'll go to my corner now. I do think the deck would be better with a more veriaty of big nasties though. :)
"It that Betrays" would be a great addition to this deck. make them sac 2 permanents and then get gain control of them. :)
iI considered things like Titans, but I decided against them. The main idea here is I cast a cascade spell and pass, you draw a card and resign. All of my creatures are immune to spot removal, the sphinx is actually the easiest one to block (because a flyer with 2 protections is "easy" to block), and they are all blue. The last one is actually huge, as the counterspells will win you games. Simply put, those are the only three things that matter in a creature, anything else is fluff. That's why I won't add the titans for example. One creature that just occurred to me that I will definitely is Jin Gitaxias. He is just amazing.
oh along with a Blightsteel colossus, maybe darksteel colossus too. :)
Its been awhile since I've seen a game changing deck at this site. This might be one of them. Congradulations on a possible new archetype. Some current Aarchetypes in Legacy I can name Show and Tell Hivemind Dredge Tempered Steel Merfolk Stoneblade Reanimator RedDeckWins Infect Zoo Cascade of Hypergenesus (Cascade for short) might be a new archetype we'll see.
Thanks, although I would have to largely disagree with your list. I would say that the best decks right now are (in no order): Stoneblade, Maverick, ANT, TEAM, and Reanimator. Also, "Tempered Steel" is called Affinity in legacy, and Infect is not a deck :P I don't really see this making a huge splash, certainly not the way my work on Affinity did, but maybe.
Oh, and how did I forget Delver Tempo?
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Wouldn't bloodbraid elf help with consistancy? Same cost as outburst so you don't have to worry about cascading into that. Just a thought.
Nope I'm gonna go sit with the other dunce. Braids is 4 drop
YEA!! company. it was getting lonely in the corner by myself. :)
Ummm... Yea. Also, since its a 4-drop it can cascade into SSG/ESG, making you cry
Awesome deck, though I would replace the sphinxes with ulamog, you dont get his cast ability but he is a 10/10 indestructible with annihilator 4 for extra kicks, which means if he attacks they pretty much lose and if they have a field wipe after you combo then they lose anyway...
sphinx is insane against aggro and it pitches to force of will, wich is pretty important.
Not going to bother to rewrite the same concept so I will quote myself: "I considered things like Titans [and Ulamog], but I decided against them. The main idea here is I cast a cascade spell and pass, you draw a card and resign. All of my creatures are immune to spot removal, the sphinx is actually the easiest one to block (because a flyer with 2 protections is "easy" to block), and they are all blue. The last one is actually huge, as the counterspells will win you games. Simply put, those are the only three things that matter in a creature, anything else is fluff. That's why I won't add the titans for example. One creature that just occurred to me that I will definitely is Jin Gitaxias. He is just amazing."
Definitely take out Grand Coliseum imo. Maybe gemstone mine instead?
Why? The life-loss matters much less than the reusability IMO
Its not the life loss that strikes me, its how much that land slows the deck. Going off turn 1 or 2 can make the difference in legacy, and coliseum doesn't help your cause much. 3 times use should be more than enough
I agree with the addition of gemstone mine, maybe even gemstone cavern too.
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How does suspend 3 work? Love the deck idea.
How do decks become Popular? I am new on here and I am just curious on how to get my deck on the home page. I saw one guys who was popular but he was the only one who commented on and he had 79 likes.
Mrbig262: suspend has no CMC but you can not play it from your hand without paying the suspend cost unless your casting it some other way. such as Cascade. Basically you pay the suspend cost and the card is exiled with X time counters on it. each upkeep you take off a time counter. once it hits 0 you play the spell. Cheese of Phyrexia: there are only 2 ways to make a deck popular that I know of. 1 is for people to click the lick button, the other is for people to post comments on the deck other then yourself. each post gives I think 3 likes to the deck.
Each deck has a score, which is displayed as "likes". If you click the "like" button the deck gets +1. If someone other than the deckowner comments, the deck gets +3 (So the series of comments I'm posting now as I have been away from the computer net me no bonus). See the deck description for an explanation of suspend and the combo
Actually, suspend doesn't matter to this deck so I won't post what it means there, however there are a few mistakes in Lurker's description. Suspend is an alternate casting cost that has a built in delay. Whenever you use the "suspend x" ability of a spell, you exile it with X time counters on it. At the beginning of each upkeep you remove one suspend counter, and when it hits 0 you may cast the spell. It is true that Hypergenesis has no casting cost (and therefore cannot be cast normally from your hand), however there are cards with suspend and a casting cost.
If the only thing your going to cascade into is hypergenesis then you only need 1 in the deck, I say play more "free" type spells like force or more big creatures
And if he draws it?
right, he needs multiple copies in the deck just in case he does draw one or start with it in hand.
If someone counter the first one, its pretty crucial to be able to do it again.
I also have a deck based on this combo. Though my deck onclude iona, Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre, angel of despair and sundering titan. in addition to the cascade cards for the combo I have 3x demonic dreads for ensuring that I always have a cascade card at hand. Against aggro decks i have 4x firesprout in my sideboard, and versus blue i have 4x Vexing Shushers (i find it wourth the risk of cascading into it). Ive played this deck a while, and ive found out that its really annoying getting 2 of the same legendary creatures in one hand, therefore i only use 2 of each legendary creature. Tell me hat you think
Hi InternetAlias, I think think you should post a link to your deck. Then we can really see and comment on your deck.
I actually really don't like your deck. Your creatures are generally worse than mine, only paying one Jin is just stupid (my old list is exempt as I made it before that card was printed), and the lack of counterspells also really hurts you deck. I also dislike slowing it down by dropping SSG/ESG
heres the link to my Cascade Hypergenesis deck, have a look if you like :) http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=261906
So if you play Hypergenesis with cascade you dont have to wait for its suspend counters to be removed? If thats the case then WOW!! Great job on inventing a new deck type!
as much as I love Joe's decks, this was an extended deck for a while before he posted this.
Shhh! I discovered the idea on my own, so I still get the full credit! Besides, I was the first person to make it work in legacy without you getting laughed at.
that's very true, and you've spawned a breed of players who made my life as a reanimator interesting. Your decks always seem to make amusing players pop up Joe, I rather enjoy that about them
I would add Blightsteel Colossus, Infect Trampe 11/11 is gross and can't really be dealt with (minus O-Ring and the like).
Ummmm..... Swords to Plowshares :/
it seems like the thing most ppl are complaining about your deck is the whole legendary thing... IF you want i would look into maybe adding a couple Mirror Gallery. it's a 5 drop artifact that says the legendary rule doesn't apply. w/ that, you get more emrakul, more progenitus, and more win. xD honestly even just having one of either of those out those is pretty much a win... just a thought. i love the deck! i'm happy to see a half decent deck on the vault! :D
To play Mirror, I would have to take out some legendaries. Therefore, no. Also, its totally win-more and silly.
i think i became half-awesome!!!!
this is really damn cool, but are you sure you can cast hypergenesis? This text is on Evermind: Card Text: (Spells without mana costs can't be played.) Draw a card. Evermind is blue. Splice onto Arcane 1U Oracle Text: (Nonexistent mana costs can't be paid.) Draw a card. Splice onto Arcane 1U (As you cast an Arcane spell, you may reveal this card from your hand and pay its splice cost. If you do, add this card's effects to that spell.) Same with hypergenesis?
Yep! Luckily, you can cast it via alternate methods, including Cascade (and suspend).
jesus christ though man. this is so fast. Turn zero Emrakul. Extremely nice job.
turn 1 sorry.
im not really that good of a player but i will just share my opinion:D i think you need more cascade spells to increase the chances of drawing at least one. katari remnant will be good. 4 drop and also blue so you can feed it to FoW jst in case. demonic dread is a 3 drop but it needs a target so i think any 4 to cast blue spell with cascade will be better.
I agree with the addition of katari remnant. can Be fed to FoW and could cascade into hypergenesis or one of the other cascade cards and re-cascade. Requires more mana but I think it is worth it. Also consider finding a replacement for Grand Colleseum, consider Gemstone Mine or you could even add Gemstone Cavern and Leyline of Anticipation and make this deck go off turn 0. :)
To those mentioning Katari Remnant, I would like to point out the spirit guides cost three. However, Demonic Dread is something that could be looked into, but I somehow feel Joe already has. I'm in shock noticing the Grand Coliseum, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was there because of him using most of his rainbow lands elsewhere.
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yeah.. my mistake.. katari's cascade would hit the spirits. the problem with demonic dread is it would be useless without a legal target and i think this deck need a little bit more cascade spells just to be sure to draw at least one on the opening hand rather the wait for topdecking it.
Wasn't thinking, I just looked for cards that said cascade lol. And this is literally as cascade filled as it can get, all the other cards with it are four and up :/ I personally think this is the best possible design possible for the idea right now, excluding the Coliseum.
Yea, I agree the Coliseums are not the best choice. I never play TES, so I'll move my Gemstone Mines to this deck. Dread... Well, I just don't know. I found it was dead a sad amount of the time, especially as the meta has shifted away from creature heavy decks where I am.
dread could actually work!! you have four copies of forbidden orchard which could produce targets for it... im going try this deck out and see how well it does:D. im looking at 10-12 cascade spells.. sure needs a lot of testing to see if this could compete well against tournament quality decks.
The real question is where do you put it? I'm trying out a version that is -2 ESG, +2 Dread. ESG has been frustrating me because once you add Dread it only contributes colored mana to 4 of your 10 cascade spells. I might also drop a Hypergenesis for an extra Progen. The sb is the tricky part IMO. The restriction on CMC 1 and 2 cards can be annoying. Another sphinx might be nice vs aggro. The really hard MU this deck has though is Tempo Thresh, with Wasteland and Stifle and 8 free counterspells for Hypergenesis, and I'm not sure how we could improve that. On the other hand, Bant, NO RUG, Maverick, and Dredge are pretty easy wins. We can even beat Dredge g1, and if we put Leylines over Misdirection...
Maybe I should get my dunce cap and stool ready before I ask this but what would be the ideal opening hand/hands for this deck? I'm a pretty casual magic player, so the card combo isn't really jumping out at me...other than cascading into hypergenesis and putting big, expensive creatures into play for free
That is really all there is to it. Beating a turn 2 Progenitus is REALLING FLIPPING HARD