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Artifacts are beast. Here's to MUD Stax!
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What? No metal worker to go with all this? Saaad panda. I've never really liked MUD Stax personally, I prefer mono-white stax for the Enlightened Tutors. But yours is actually an interesting list for it, I especially approve of running Tangle Wire, it gives so many options to stax really. Three mana for a card that slows aggro, messes with countertop, AND can keep storm back a turn? Yes, very yes!
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Metal worker is baaaaaaaad in Stax! Maybe you are thinking of MUD Stompy? This deck is lock first, win later. I considered W for ET, but I feel that MUD is more powerful. I get to run the best utility lands in Legacy, including a 8 land disruption package precisely because the deck has no colors. Also, I have so many lock cards, fitting Tutor into the deck is actually a challenge! Tanglewire is a boss, as long as you remember to not tap Trinisphere that is!
I've only ever made white stax, and two Metal Workers wound up completing the deck for me. I agree that the deck is lock first, that's how a LOT of things I like go, but I found the added ramp made the locks easier to maintain. White Stax is admittedly the weaker of the two, but it fed my toolbox fix. I really enjoy the toolbox approach to building, and it's one of the most dangerous toolboxes in Legacy right now.
How much other ramp do you have though? The thing I really don't like about him is that you gotta wait a who turn to use him.
I think the ramp count came to about sixteen with the lands, I had a rather... unorthodox... Win condition placed in the deck, in the form of a singleton Ulamog.
Huh... Interesting. Really? Ulamog? What other W cards do you run?
Wait, not Ulamog, Emrakul... Got my tardazi mixed up there lol. I ran a pretty simple supply of white really, I ran two moats, a playset of ET, some Oblivion Rings, and I think I might have had a Ghostly Prison... I dismantled that deck a LOOONG time ago, I can barely remember how it went.
I'll put aside my current hostile thoughts for now to tell you that I like this. It's another very good artifact design. I forget what MUD stands for?
Hahahaha thanks man! MUD actually doesn't stand for anything, rather it refers to the mud-like color that artifacts used to be. Any comments/criticisms?
Ah that's right. Not much I can say about this really. Lodestone is a nice addition to the package. This deck seems like it's also playing in mud...very messy and slow.
Any criticisms?
Not really =P
I'm thinking of dropping Jitte, as I only got a handful of creatures. Ideas on what to replace it with?
Not sure if it'll be good in here, but in every use of Isolation Cell I've had, the opponent wants to punch me. It is BRUTAL, and might fit in here. I took your advice and changed my "Little Chocolate Donuts" deck to be B/U if you want to take a look at the changes.
Mmkay, I did a rough doodling of mono-white Stax based off of how I remember the list... I drew a lot of blanks, so I just kind of made a new one heavily influenced by your MUD Stax here... I really hate artifact decks dude, they need a more rigid structure than I care for :/
Is that a good thing? Not sure what your saying...
I'm a bit lost myself, I'm at somewhere around 36 hours sleep dep... I'm 'bout the point where hallucinations happen.
What do you guys think of Gambit here? Colorless draw, lets me add counters to Stax or Wire...
Gambit is a neat idea, and definitely worth testing. I think proliferating the wire is also just freaking hilarious, it's kind of like waving a carrot in front of a horse to keep it going XD
do you think the other orbs could be good in here? winter orb works great for me and orb of dreams is a good idea too i think.
Winter is on the SB. I would like to include dreams, but I'm unsure where it could fit. Ideas?
oh, i did not see it there. :) for orb of dreams i think you could afford to have 3 chalices and 3 monoliths without any complications, but that is just me. control is not my thing, so i'm unsure i'm the best to take advice from for this, but that is what i'd do.
Maybe... I feel the turn 1 tramp is very important though... T1 Trinisphere is deadly. Thanks though :)
Did this deck randomly show up on the Upcomming list? I guess that's the site's way of saying this deck is cool :D
Maybe it's because someone said something about it. Also maybe someone "liked" it (buddysystem) and pushed it up to here
Ahhh lol. Although it was already on the page before my comment, and you notice there are no recent comments... It didn't occur to me that a single "like" made the difference
actually he is completely right!
I see too many trinishperes, It is restricted to 1.
Interestingly, Trinisphere is only restricted in Vintage play. In Legacy it is fully allowed :)
That's odd... :O
Not when you consider how drastically slower Triniphere can make a Vintage deck. It neutralizes Black Lotus...
...Ponder is too.
I'm really confused about a wincon in this deck... With Smoke stack going, wouldn't you also run out of permanents?
I am wondering the same as GrimVictor. I really like the addition of Tezz's Gambit perhaps even run one extra to make the deck faster.
@GrimVictor, @Thorai; The deck can win by waiting for the opponent to deck, getting them to scoop, or beatdown via Lodestone XD It's a bit like Lands in that regard.
So it's basically a waiting game. I don't know if I could handle that.
Most people can't. I can't even stand to watch my buddy play his Prison deck. It takes like...50 god damn turns to win if the opponent doesn't give up first. Legacy Prison/STAX basically is the control side of the suicide deck idea. You screw over yourself less than you screw over your opponent, and thus you are the victor!
Isn't there a danger of decking yourself if you go down that path? as after all it has only 60 cards, and there doesn't seem to be anything to return things from your graveyard to your library. plus with gambit you actually draw extra cards in some turns.
A little...But that's sort of the "art" of playing Prison. The deck usually has some kind of chiseling factor too if things look like they're headed that way.
^Mishra's Factory, and Lodestone Golem for Stax. Nether Spirit, Tombstalker, and more factories for Pox. And for my particular brand of Nether Void decks, Bloodghast, and Factories XD These decks are classified as 'lockdown', 'lockout', 'prison', and 'suicide control' usually. My builds fall in the category of lockout, and sometimes suicides. I don't stare my opponent down, I beat them there.
Don't forget my buddy Arty's form of Prison...The good old "I'll kick your ass with your own cards." style -_- I'd say you're mostly Suicontrol man, you would marry Braids if she were a real chick.
Derp, I knew I was forgetting something. And as for Braids, I think I'd have to pass... Had more than my share of sociopaths >_<
Ah, my two amigos who explain what the hell I'm doing because I am too busy brewing to notice :) They got it basically right, you are at a bigger disadvantage than I am. Couz my deck is more or less built to play around its own disruption. Plus Lodestone and Factories will kck your face in. But here's the beautiful part: games take a long time if you play until you deck. In a tournament setting, games are timed and at the end who ever has the most life wins. I don't need to win, I just need to kick you in the face and wait. And since most tournament players know this, they will scoop after the lock is down so that they might have time to win game 2 and 3
So it is a staring match? You could play a static orb then.
Static orb is too easy to stop... The idea is that getting two or three things down stops you from blowing them up ^_^ What? You expect me to play fair?
Oh wow I just got an evil idea... Jitte. Now I don't need to punch you to win, I just gotta attack to win ^_^ Hey surewhynot.... Have I won the official "Evil" stamp yet? I don't mean this deck, I mean as a deck builder?
I dunno about him, but most people gave you that when you made your Ghast Control deck. Thing was just nasty.
<_< I swear I knighted you as an official Evil Builder...If not I hereby dub thee "Sir Ragged, of the MOTHERF**KING Affinity deck." Yes I'm still bitter...
I know what you mean... My reanimator has as of yet lost ONE MATCH to an aggro deck... I wonder what they could have been using... Oh yes, Joe's list.
^_^ Have you checked it out recently? It's gotten better. I now have spot removal with no draw-backs!
By the way, Smallpox and Bloodghast are in T2 at the same time shortly.. I've been trying things but I can't get it reliable, since there are like 0 ways to tutor bloodghast in T2. Which is sad coup I got Seer and Highborn too :(
Either aggro or MBC will rock with Smallpox. No need to tutor, because MBC is already in full abuse.
Yeah, I keep tabs on your affinity primer on salvation, and on the deck itself here... I keep finding myself going 'if it wasn't for you, I'd be a king against all breeds of aggro...' Each time I see changes I just kind of sigh and note what's threatening me the most.
^_^ To Savaj: Ahhh, innocence. What I had in mind with those two cards was something more inline with my Bloodghast Control deck. Check it out.
Can I have your Tabernacle please? I'll give you my car.
Hmmm... Mine are actually both signed by the artist and foil.. How about 2 cars?
My original comment was going to be "I hate you. And this deck. In an endearing sort of way." I hereby amend my first comment to be such, minus the endearing part.
Also, you have a deal.
I don't understand why noone likes me... I get those comments a lot :'( :P What kinds of car?
SavajCabbaj has deleted this comment.
It's a Jeep. There's only actually one of them, but for the duration of this deal I will maintain double vision. Geddit while you can! And gibba gibba gibba.. I wants some a/b/u cards.. If only I was born a few years earlier I could put myself through college via hobby alone >.> Infernal parents...
So, for Jitte... -1 Gambit -1 Torpor Orb?
I think I'd go with that as well if you want Jitte in the deck.
You don't think I should?
On reflection, I think I'd just take the orbs out all together, drop in a pair of Jittes, and up Gambit to a playset. Toropr Orb is more of a sideboard thing to me. I like the idea of Jittes here, it's just it seems a bit win-more to me. I like my stax to lock first, lock again, and then come back the next day to make sure nothing changed other than them scooping. Also(blatant advertising ahead!), I made a Pox deck I think you might find interesting. I'd love some feedback on it
The thing is, so many guys have epic ETB effects. SFM, Painter's Servant, and the new Lord to name 3. He also stops Vengevine, Hulk combo,
True. I guess I'm meta biasing again, as the only ETB I keep seeing is SFM. Which while epic, has never been worth Torpor to me. I can follow your logic though, so go for it man.
Torpor Orb. With Gambit, you're still more likely to draw it, but ETB effects are less rare than the need to draw cards.
Damn... Chalice of the Void for 0? Shut down that Glimpse of Nature deck, and the Lotus/Petals/Moxen...If you're going first.
IMO fatty stax are better then mud stax.
Yay constructive criticism! I've never heard of Fatty Stax though... This deck is not really a stax deck anymore, so maybe I should change the name. Its a lock deck more akin to DStompy... RoboStompy maybe?
It's kind of like the non-German MUD Stompy decks I've been seeing, but without the added 'boom' of Steel Hellkite(yes, it's used in Legacy now).
I've seen those things. Weirdest freaking version of Stompy I have EVER seen...
I prefer the German variation of MUD Stompy, but those ones are pretty neat. I've even seen an Iso-Stompy, which was basically an Extraction deck using stompy-esque tactics for a sword/shield.
http://www.myfacewhen.com/i/493.jpg
I *think* they might have called it Rainbow Stomp, I dunno. It wasn't that great as an extraction deck, because it spent more time trying to actively kill, but it was a pretty neat stompy. Have you ever had to stare down a table with Overwhelming Stampede on Panoptic Mirror being backed by Iso-Seek? It was insane
Oh, yeah...I've seen those. Iso-Beats/AggroSeek/every other name its had...it's a strange fringe idea that never seems to work just right. I think it's one of those things where while trying to get the best of both worlds, the deck ends up being sub-par in all areas. They pop up from time to time and make people say "wtf is that?" and then they vanish just as quick =P Poxtraction Aggrolock though...Those can give Iso-Seek a run for its money >_>
Yeah, Stompy shouldn't let things go to that many turns usually, and Extraction shouldn't be a side deal. Poxtraction is definitely not a joke like whatever that thing was. I had to use a pass the turn pile for doomsday once, and they killed me by top decking a Bitter Ordeal... I lost because they just cast it all nonchalantly, and just ripped out Iggy.
main deck Blinkmoths and Inkmoths. The former buffs the latter and makes for a very fast clock. (4-5 turns is pretty fast for stax)
I could... But why? Inkmoth and Mishra are the same speed clock. Besides, people use fetchlands and bob and such. I also use loadstone... So why add poison? Doesn't make much sense
Fatty stax is the use of smokestack for lock down, and killing them with huge creatures.
Ever think of using Karn liberated in this deck for added deprevation? Added with the gambits you basically -2 to dispatch a permanent.
Yea, but he's rather expensive for what he does. It's cool, but kinda impractical.
So funny story, I have a Robo-stax deck I use at my local gaming store when players have breaks in between matches and new friend of mine brought his sneak n show deck. Well the funny part starts when we sideboard and I decided to side in my humility's. I basically took out my big beaters because his were just better and got the job done. but with my tangle wire's and humility he just couldn't handle it.
Lolz. That's cool
so quick question, what is your opinion of mirrorworks in a MUD Stax deck... I was kinda toying with the idea. I love the fact I could make copies of smokestack or tanglewire.... lol sorry for the zombification of this deck
I would not play it, as its dead on your first few turns, and is really only good if you have another good card. I would just rather play more cards that are good. Heres an analogy because I don't think I am being clear... Burns {R} Instant ~ deals 2 damage to target creature or player. Only cast this spell if that creature or player has taken non-combat damage this turn. Would you play this in a burn deck? The analogy doesn't work perfectly, as burn has a much greater threat density than we do, but the concept is similar. This card is better in Burn than Mirrorworks is here, as it can be very easily played. But I hope I get the idea accross.
Yo! I was gonna consult you on a [Mud] Stax. But this looks exactly like what I was thinking about. I really wanna keep it cheap, and a bit more casual...lol.
Most of the cost is the lands, Diamonds, and Monoliths. If you are willing to use inferior ramp (perfectly OK in a casual environment I think), the price drops a lot. Watseland + Tab + Mox + Monolith ~ $1,060 of the mid value. Cities are another $120, so if you can replace the ramp and the extras (Tab and Wasteland) it should be pretty cheap
Rishadan Port >_> $90, I need the Cities for sure, that's $200, Ancient Tomb makes it $250...It's definitely the land. Check out my list and teach me a bit about it. I mostly understand how it will work, I think Basalt Monolithe should work well enough, yeah?
Expedition Map just blew my mind!
Yea, that card is pretty bonkers
What do you think of Crystal Vein? With Crucible, it's pretty good.