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It is a Grixis discard/control deck that makes you swear because no matter what you do you're getting screwed. Kinda like the feeling when you hear your lady ask the classic, "Do these jeans make me look fat?", question....there just are no good way out of the situation! ______________________ Concept: Have the opponent lose life passively through both card drawing and discarding 1. Have opponent lose life from Underworld Dreams : Forced card drawing and as a part of turn upkeep 2. Have opponent lose life from Liliana's Caress : Discard spells and discard abilities of the specters 3. Have opponent lose life from combat damage done by creatures - most notably, Abyssal Nocturnus PLEASE!!! Any advice would be appreciated. Thank you. - 3 Piracy Charm + 2 Chains of Mephistopheles, + 1 Burning Inquiry - 2 Apathy + 2 Spiteful Visions -4 Dragonskull Summit +4 Blood Crypt -4 Drowned Catacombs +4 Watery Grave -2 Chains of Mephistopheles + 2 Spiteful Visions - 2 Blizzard Specter + 2 Jace's Archivist - 2 Apathy + 2 Blightning - 3 Cephalid Broker + 2 Cephalid Looter + 1 Chandra Ablaze -4 Blood Crypt + 2 Dragonskull Summit + 2 Mountains -4 Watery Grave + 2 Drowned Catacombs + 2 Islands
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I like this deck a lot man. Pretty evil. I highly recommend Urza's Guilt. It hurts you a little (4 measly life) but often, in a deck like this, it will kill everyone in one shot. =]
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Absolutely! I never knew such a beautiful card existed! Thank you for pointing it out to me - a MUST in multi player games (which I mostly play) and I will always happily hurt myself if it means I hurt my opponent(s) more! I just wish it was one mana cheaper...oh well. Thank you again my Sensei!
Always glad to help out a friend man. I wish it was cheaper too, but can also see why they had to keep it at that cost. One last thing I would warn you about is the inevitable worst-case scenario for a discard deck. And it's a very ironic one -- your opponent runs out of cards in their hand. In my discard deck, I run I think 2 Temple Bells to compensate this. You might not need to do this, since you have more of a "guilt" deck anyway. (my friends came up with the name because of Urza's Guilt. It means a deck that takes both discard and draw into damage). Cheers! =]
Actually, that is the whole reason this deck was created in the first place. My discard deck works beautifully, I win 2/3 times I play it, and even when I loose, 1/2 the time I can get my opponent down to 5 or lower before they can catch up and beat me. So its a blast. But you nailed the problem perfectly. I have placed 4 racks and most recently (though haven't tried it yet) added 4 Wheel of Torture to deal with that effect. It never occurred to me to add Temple Bells - beautiful! I think ill side board them for now till I see how Wheel of Torture does... Thanks sir!
Howling mine will be pretty cool :)
Thought about the mine, but Im not sure I want my opponent drawing them for free. Its cool to draw them, and then have to discard them instantly, but I dont want to give them a full turn with full mana to use them against me. Dont worry, I have thought about it. I too much of a double edged sword in this situation.
If you don't want them to draw for free add Spiteful Visions. It's Howling Mine + Underworld Dreams combined.
really nice on the discard life loss. the only thing i would do is take an abyssal nocturnus out and put in one more sedraxis spector. next, take out a burning inquiry and put it one more wistful thinking
Hmmm. You know, I have to agree on getting a 3rd Sedaxis, but I am wary of taking an Abyssal Nocturnus away to do it. He could be devastating in this deck. Blightning, though insanely powerful, might be limited in this deck - just based on the fact that the opponent may have no cards to discard. I think that is the swap I will make - and give it a try. I have to get some more ink before I can proxy this deck out and give it a real trial. But huge thank you sir!
Your opponent will (if able) play the entire hand as quick as possible and have no hand to discard. Throw in Anvil of Bogardan - forces each player both to draw and discard a card every turn. a card
Thank you David. I actually agree with you. I had it in this deck when I it was initially created, but found too many other good cards that force my opponent to draw/discard. Something had to go, and as is, I wish I could have 80 cards in it without slowing it down. I will (continue to) think about it, but I think Anvil of Bogardan is more effective in a straight discard deck. But once again, thank you!
Hmmm just discovered Cephalid Broker, I think he works perfectly in this deck. I wonder, if I should start adding in more Cephalids - Cephalid Looter is the one that fits best, but they seem like a fascinating tribal all the same...
And Memory Jar too....Hmmmm, could be brutal.
gaah i hate cephalids. A new person just joined my playgroup and he stopped getting new cards at mirrodin and one of his three decks is cephalid (he has more, he just has 3 he plays with). Its the most boring deck to play against and it almost always wins -.-
I bet!!! I have never actually played against a cephalid - as far as I know. Im fairly new to MTG and they were before my day (which was actually Rise of the Eldrazi), but I am thinking of trying to bring them back in style. My only issue with a tribal deck is that there are not a lot of them and it wouldn't leave me a lot of creativity. But, I suppose I should take that as a challenge.... ;)
um... is it just me, or aren't you only allowed to have a 15 card sideboard? lol
Yah - I dont play competitively, just for fun. I never use a proper sideboard and just use the space here to store other random ideas. Not even sure how this deck would do in a competition and wouldnt know where to start with a real sideboard.
Underworld dreams seems good and inspires people to make decks built around it but put in Kederekt Parasite, psychosis crawler, or Niv-Mizzet, the firemind. they do the job alot better
Thank you for pointing out Kederekt Parasite - I like the card, and I never knew she existed. Unfortunately, as i sit, I only have 6 red permanents in the deck...Certainly going on my sideboard/'cards for me to think about board'!!! Psychosis Crawler and Niv-Mizzet are simply a bit to pricey mana wise for me in this deck, if I am going to make this work, I've gotta be quick about it! I figure the deck is slow enough as is and REALLY wish I could think of some ways to speed it up without losing its fun factor or its effectiveness. Thats really my big concern at this point. I can think of too many fast decks that would tear this one up before it really got going. That said, however, I think I feel the inspiration for another deck coming on...! This could be fun....thank you!
uhmm, Liliana vess + Jace t.m.s! O.O" could work in the right circumstances, not sure how it will fit the deck or the strategy, but those two planeswalkers are great for discard. Just a suggestion
Besides, if Jace and Liliana were going out, imagine her asking that question to Jace :P it would be funny hahaha
HA! That would be funny! Wouldn't want to see them together, they'd have F'cked up kids... But you're right...not sure how they'd fit in.
no cards in hand = quest for the nihil stone
You know...I love discard decks, and frankly I have always been a little prejudice against Nihil Stone...unless I got him in my original hand, he likely isn't that useful. However, I believe you are right - and my prejudice may have blinded me - Quest of the Nihil Stone would be fantastic in this deck! Now, just not sure what would be the right cards to remove...any suggestions? ....and thanks!
i very much like this deck. the theme is possibly my second fave in all of magic. check out my discard burn deck called respira http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=145730
Checked it out - nice deck! I may 'borrow' some ideas for another similar deck I am making...thanks for the positive words buddy!
Chains of Mephistopheles! Chains of Mephistopheles! Chains of Mephistopheles! ...you should go find some Chains of Mephistopheles! So you can include Chains of Mephistopheles! (Look it up and you'll see why...)
Ooooooo.....oh......wow.........I'd just want to put it out to confuse my opponent if nothing else. Wow!. Aside from the great advice - thanks for the humorous post....made me smile!
man that is the most confusing card ive ever read, can someone break it down for me?
Player is forced to draw multiple cards, say 2 for the sake of simplicity: card 1 - nothing happens card 2 - player discards a card (the card 1 they had just drawn, if noting else) and keeps card 2. If they cannot, they much mill the top card of their deck. This effect applies to each card drawn, so if 'Burning Inquiry' is uses, the opponent would have to do this twice. Thats my understanding - the Oracle text on Gatherer is confusing - and looks like there is an endless loop. However, I think the actual card text is more clear - and realistic. If the endless loop existed, the card would simply be banned. But that said, I just came off of a night shift and my brain is a little foggy...can anyone else offer some clairity?
The legends version text is shall i say more understandable if that's even possible
No bloodchief ascension? may not be nessesary but It could work well once its online.
Very true, but, not necessarily necessary...if that makes sense....Ive been reading the Chains of Mephistopheles text too much
Megrim costs one more, but it would be like extra Liliana's Caress...
Megrim was in here originally, but not for long, too much money for an effect that is already present. It would give me better odds, as you stated, but I am not sure it would be necessary. I have 4 so if ever I am in need, I can drop them in easy! Thanks for the advice through!
Did I mention Spiteful Vision, yes I did;)
Yes you did... ;) So, my only concern is the cost - 4 mana is pricey - it will slow me down even more, but I think it might be worth it. Certainly worth a try! Thank you very much!
Drawing an extra card can't slow you down, can it?
I love this deck concept bro. About halfway down the list my roommate had to find out why I was laughing so hard. He'd absolutely hate this deck. Props bro, props.
Good - that makes me happy! Its always nice to see someone shares my humor. And a very sincerer thank you to you! I like winning games, but I LOVE pissing my opponent off more. Nothing in magic gives me the same high! Rushing my opponent with 6 X 30/30 elves gets boring, and you always get the same 'good game', but when you really get under someones skin, no two freak outs are the same, you never know what will happen! Thats fun! Now, if I can do both.... ;)