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a land based deck using Oracle of Mul Daya and Fastbond for mana and Liege of the Tangle to make them 8/8 creatures
This deck has been viewed 2,797 times.
Nothing but forests will be drawn, but it's a good idea
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I recommended less forests and more deck thinning. Cultivate, fetchlands, harrow, Khalni Heart Expedition, Evolving wilds, stuff like that
thats why i use Fastbond and Oracle of Mul Daya so i can play all of the forests quickly
Remember, Oracle of Mul Daya still only allows you to play 2 lands per turn. Even if your top card is a land card you still may only play 2 per turn even though it stated that you may play the top card if it's a land card. I had to find that out the hard way unfortunately. Still, not a bad idea, but it won't pay off well enough to be worthwhile.
@ wanosk54 if you look at fastbond you will see that he can play as many lands as his life goes
overwhelming stampede isnt really necessary
you'll draw nothing at all but forests. put other stuff in.
the Oracle of Mul Daya lets you play with the top card reveled and with fastbond if it is a land i can play it. this allows me to play many lands quickly and thin out out the deck to get to what i need
The only problem is you won't be drawing her any time soon with all the forests
I know having 40 lands in a 62 card deck is kinda crazy but you got to believe me that it works. if you can get the right hand you can have Liege of the Tangle out by turn 1 or 2. And yes this deck can be that fast
That's simply not going to happen O_O Okay first 2 turns means 9 cards total. You need 8 forests, Liege, and Fastbond for that to happen. That's 10 cards. Now imagine you starting with Mul Daya, Fastbond, Liege and 4 forests and you draw another forest on your starting turn. First turn use fastbond to drop all your lands and play Mul Daya. Now assume your top card is a land. Play it. You now have 6 forests. To get Liege out next turn both of your next cards must be forests. They ONLY way to get Liege out is to have a PERFECT 11 card draw. Otherwise you're sitting on your butt doing nothing and allowing your opponent to build up land for control. What happens when they Revoke Existence your Liege? Doom Blade it? Deathmark it? Pacify it? Oblivion Ring? Negate your Green Sun's Zenith? Counterspell? Your opponent has plenty of creatures to kill Liege without taking any damage? They play liquimetal and Splinter your Forest removing literally every single one from the game? This deck seems to be pretty flavorless and once your main strategy is foiled by justa couple of cards... It's kinda just done... I don't mean to hate on your deck or anything, but you need to factor in other ways for a deck to work other than 1 card... Sorry... =/
you can get liege out first turn.. with the hand you stated. i dont think you quite understand how oracle works... it allows you to play 1 extra mana per turn FROM YOUR HAND, but it also makes you play with the top card of your library revealed. the third effect is that if that top card is a land(which is very likely in this deck) you may play it. playing that land doesnt not count as using oracles first ability. so if the top 5 cards are mana you could(theoretically) choose to play all 5 of them that turn. my only advice for you nykid13 is to throw in atleast a few fetch lands so that once you get out oracle and your top card isn't a forest you can sac the land and search for a forest then shuffle library and maybe get a land on top again to fuel liege.
@buddysystem Looking at the rulings given here--http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=185737, it doesn't seem that you will be able to play more than two lands per turn just with one Oracle. The ability to play a land from the top of your library is still subject to the amount of lands you are allowed to play per turn: in this case, two. Now, with a fastbond out, you can play those lands, though they will hurt you, but just one oracle does not allow you to cycle through all lands on top of the deck until you hit a non-land card.
yeah buddy that is in fact wrong and Church is right. It specifically says that you PLAY the top card of your library and does NOT say you can play an additional land FROM YOUR HAND. and yes i suppose you could then keep going off of the first hand turn with fastbond... the point isnt that this deck could possibly work if given an absolute perfect starting hand. heck the Charbelcher deck is easier and more reliable to do that anyways. To get outLiege quickly AT ALL you absolutely NEED at least 1 fastbond, 1 Mul Daya, and a Liege. That's a (4 / 60)^3 * However many cards into the game you are / 100 = % Chance. That's NOT good.
I stand corrected! lol i'll have to let the people i play with know the rule:p
I think Gaea's Touch could fit easily in there somewhere.
Try putting Green Sun's Zenith. With that many lands, you can directly cast Liege of the Tangle from your library, and it might make your deck faster.
Green Sun's Zenith looks pretty sweet. I havent seen much of the new set but i will add it for sure. Thanks
put in green sun's zenith or fauna shaman
Fastbond is banned in all Formats except in Vintage where it is Restricted. Just letting you know. Exploration is another good option that is not Banned or Restricted.
Thanks for letting me know but i mostly play casual with my friends
use the "draw sample hand" and you'll see that it doesn't work. you'd have to be pulling some free mulligans just to get your "right hand" and I hope you understand that this website is to help players help each other, so getting mad when people tell you your deck doesn't work kiiiiiinda defeats the purpose of posting it in the first place don't you think?
Dude I am not getting mad. I am just trying to explain how the deck works. I actually own and play this deck with my friends.
Your deck is so cool that I want to try making it myself. But i'd probably just use 1 fastbond and go with either a set of manabond or exploration. I'm also thinking of splashing a little blue to be able to use magus of the future. what do you think? :)
Magus of the Future would be totally worth it in this deck. To use it I guess switch out 10 or so forests for islands so you know you could play it as quickly as you can. But I think I would stick with the set of Fastbond. But if you wanted to switch some of them out then I would use Manabond over Exploration because Manabond lets you play all of the lands in your hand and exploration only lets you play one other land per turn.
It would get slower with a splash of blue and the manabond, so it will not win as fast as this one. But at least I can still choose the hand I want with this many lands. Maybe add in teferi to work with it. ;)
That would make the deck more interesting. Let me try it out and I will get back to you on it.
Maybe instead of magus of the future, we can use treasure hunt. it would be cheaper. :)
This could actually work, and that's pretty neat. For all of the 'lolol only forets wil b drawn' crowd, might I recommend clicking "Draw Sample Hand" once in a while? This deck will work just fine! So long as the opening hand has a fastbond, GSZ, or Oracle in it, this deck will work just FINE. And I think that's awesome! Kudos to the creator.
Thanks dude
Some hands work, some hands take very long to do anything. It's a fun deck, but keep in mind that the "engine" is a card that should never have been printed and is barely allowed anywhere (I'll finish by repeating that it's FUN, because it is).
The problem is (aside from legality, which you could replace Fastbond with Exploration to make the deck legal and pretty much equally effective), you are relying on a single creature (Oracle of Mul Daya) to thin out your deck and draw anything note-worthy. Without Oracle in play, you will be drawing one land most turns (two with Explore). IMO, this deck would be more consistent if you began trading out a few of the land cards for other "two for one" cards. For example, lands that fetch other lands, creatures that fetch lands, spells that enable you to fetch multiple lands... etc. Perhaps Howling Mines and the sort for additional card draws. This would reduce the overall efficiency of Oracle of Mul Daya, however it would prevent stagnant hands (if you don't draw at least 1 Oracle by turn two, you're pretty much consigning yourself to a very slow game, ineffectual game) The probability of this is: 4/63 + 4/62 + 4/61 + ..... + 4/56 = 53.86% Not bad, but consider this being just like weather forecasting. That also means there's a 46.14% chance that you will not draw her. Compound this over your need to draw mana acceleration to get her into play by turn 2 or 3, and your odds are looking more like drawing more stagnant hands than overwhelmingly fast wins. IMO, you could reduce this to ~30 lands, 10 of which being fetch lands themselves, and the additional 10 cards being land-fall oriented (Rampaging Baloths would own here) or fetch spells themselves, perhaps even Worldy Tutor to improve the odds of drawing Oracle out of your deck.
i definitely agree with savaj here if you want any ideas on landfall check out my landfall deck
To sum it up, you need cards to thin your library to enhance your chances of drawing the cards required to get the combo rolling. I'd also like to add that I do really like this deck, I think it'd be fun to construct somewhere down the road. But I also think as it stands it could use a lot of improvement.
If I were to build this deck, it would likely look something like this: http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=144828 Just thought I'd construct it to put a visual aid to what I wrote above :) Hope this helps ^-^
another very viable option besides baloths is avenger of zendikar. this turns atleast 7 forest into 0/1 plants that would get huge in a deck such as this!
I dislike Avenger of Zendikar. Not because it is a bad card (it isn't!) but because it becomes annoyingly complicated when you have multiples in play, and even worse if you have additional sources of plant creatures/tokens. Rampaging Baloths is likewise very effective, but doesn't have to worry about cluttering the board with tokens with varying quantities of +1/+1 counters.
lol valid point, but as a counter point i would like to point out that the only reason you dont like avengikar(as i like to call him) is because of how good he is lol i agree that baloths is easier to handle. but in this deck you could plop down a avengikar t2 or t3 for early defence all the while these plants are getting freaking HUGE and then plop another one late game and add an additional 15-30 0/1 plants to the battlefield! plus all your lands are probably 8/8's by now and then you just swarm them all to death lol
Definitely not disagreeing with you. If you get a mid to late game Baloth (in this case, late came would be turn 5 :P) much of your landfall "potential" is already spent, and Baloth won't be seeing much practical use.. Whereas no matter when you cast "Avengikar" he will provide some benefit. Whether you get him early for 7x 0/1 plants and dish out +1/+1 counters from there, or later on when you have 12-14 of your lands in play without much landfall left, you're still getting a swarm of 0/1's. I think in the context of what the deck does, though, it is rather moot. If /that much/ of the landfall is already spent, the game should already be over ;) That is also why you hoard fetch lands and spells after you have the mana to hardcast Liege of the Tangle, so you can explode with landfall once a Baloths hits the battlefield.
well whatever he chooses is really up to him lol but both are great cards that would enormously benefit this deck! i think avengikar is the better option however confusing the tokens may be, but baloths is also a great idea:-p
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you'll need some revive.. coz for me to beat this deck (since I love kamigwa) I'll need- four traproot kami, two wear away, and rend flesh..
consider muldaya channeler, and fauna shaman(to search for leige). My girlfriend has a similar deck and she has raging baloths, kahini hydras and protean hydras in the loop aswell
So no zuran orb and crucible of worlds. Without them your going to hurt yourself. I understand the gladeheart so put more in. Oh and if fastbond in there you should have no trouble putting in exploration instead of explore for more potential.
If you wanted to splash white terra eternal would make it ridiculous.
The only real reason that explore is for its draw power when using Oracle of Mul Daya and your top card is a nonland card you can use it to draw and keep your deck moving
It didn't even cross my mind when I was making this deck to add zuran orb and crucible of worlds. Any ideas on what to take out for them?
I can attest to this. Explore (and other cards with built in draw utility) are a huge benefit to Oracle of Mul Daya. If you hit a pocket of non-land cards, Explore goes a long way to break though them and continue to drop lands. On that note, if you do decide to test out a U/G variant of this with Magus of the Future, then Preordain would be an obvious fit. Scry to pull the nonland to the top, draw it, and keep moving on.
I have a deck like this. The difference is. It's an EDH deck with Jolrael empress of beasts. Using land fetch spells to help thin the deck and make it more likely to draw your lieges of the tangle is a good thing. While it is possible that you could aggressively mulligan down to like two cards (just the oracle and the fastbond) that's still an unlikely scenario. At the very least you should run lifegift, so that the unlikely scenario of Fastbond killing you doesn't occur.
Pretty sweet deck. And i suggest not splashing a color first of all. Also, just add a few more creatures, or something, i dont know. but it seems like for a little bit you might be vulnrable unless you get the good hand. But an awesome deck besides that, and maybe put in some landfall cards in. But all around, really cool deck.
Very unreliable deck but powerful if you get the PERFECT draw and your opponent doesn't play Path to Exile, Swords to Plowshares, Doom Blade, Go for the Throat, etc. Any removal stops this deck cold. Besides that, I think Avenger of Zendikar is almost strictly better than the Liege anyways. The Liege needs to survive through a turn to attack your opponent, deal damage, and then attack again. At this point, Ratchet Bomb completely screws you over, leaving you with few or no land remaining. Day of Judgement is even worse for you. With Avenger, you drop it, continue playing land, and attack the next turn once for the win. If they use Day of Judgement, you're still in the same type of position, but at least you still have your land with you... And Grazing Gladeheart is terrible, especially as a two-of in a deck like this. It's sideboard material at best. With a quick start that you hope for, it won't matter if you gain 20 life even.
HA! you agree with me that avenger would be perfect for this deck:) thanks!
He put the Grazing Gladeheart in their so he wouldn't kill himself with Fastbond. Regardless if another source allows you to play an additional land or not, you still lose one life for each additional land you play each turn. In this way, Grazing Gladeheart instead allows him to gain 1 life for each land played.
lol i understand why he has gladeheart in there:-p not hard to figure out lol
LOL! Although, deck is too big; -3 Forest
lols the deck will never be too big!!!! just kidding im with ulamog here, lol and if you want any further ideas you should check out my consistent "42" lands deck lol
tunnel vision and this deck is done haha
Very cool idea. Of course this deck can be stopped by a card, but show me any deck that can't be.
thats very true, then again, if you know the layout of a persons deck, you can easily tunnel vision them into submission, especially with cards like condem
if you add in some hedron crabs to this and make it a U/G on top of what you have, you could completely screw your opponents each turn on top of damage
This is awesome. I haven't had internet for the past few days so I haven't been able to see what you guys have said yet. Thank you everyone for your ideas and helping me get to the front page. This is the first deck of mine to make it to the front page.
I like the inclusion of Rampaging Baloths and Avenger of Zendikar. Very nice :) Still think you should consider running at the very least 4x Misty Rainforest and 4x Verdant Catacombs, if not also 4x Evolving Wilds.
yes i personally love it!:) i think you should drop 1 oracle 1 liege and add 1 more each of baloths and avengikar and savaj is right about the fetch lands
add 4 scute mobs and get rid of 4 lands. get rid of both asceticism and add frontier guides. add 4 cultivates instead of fastbond. add one more green suns zenith and i think this deck is good. it also would be tournament legal =]
I agree i think scute mobs would work well here
I know the arguement has already been had, but four fastbond is totally illegal. You can make the deck work without it. Run at least 3 exploration instead of the extra fastbond. More land-fetching to get the lands into play faster and filter the deck (I like harrow and/or cultivate). Replace some forests for more fetch-lands. Summer bloom if your lands still aren't piling up fast enough. If you need the summer bloom just replace the explore, otherwise, replace explore with harrow/cultivate or scute mob, or at least sakura-tribe elder. You can lose the asceticism and two lands for harrow/cultivate. If you can work in scute mobs, they'll go really well in this deck, too. Personally, I would lose three more land and one liege for this. That still leaves you 35 lands, with eight fetch-lands thats 27 forests. How many 8/8's do you need to kill a guy? I'd still take out three more for harrow/cultivate again if you haven't already added both, and another land for either a fourth green suns's zenith or a tooth and nail (with entwine, it would cost as much mana as zenithing a liege). That gives you 8 recurring ways to play extra land, four instant ways, and 7 spells that fetch two lands each out of the deck, and will be much less dependant on a difficult-to-draw combo that is illegal anyway.
Even without Fastbond (1x Fastbond and 3x Exploration, or 4x Exploration) there is enough "play an additional land" ability in this deck that Summer Bloom would be overkill, and the loss of card draw would be killer. That card draw is very important to help Oracle of Mul Daya do her thing. Fetch lands (as opposed to spells, as they too can be used to shuffle the library as a proxy effect to Explore's card draw, if Mul Daya hits a wall of permanents) and Nature's Spiral would be much more important to run. Oracle of Mul Daya is really what pushes this deck over the top, and will surely be the focus of any kind of removal available in the opponents' arsenal. Any way to bring her back is essential to winning, especially because without her, this deck is severely gimped. Likewise, Sylvan Tutor or Worldly Tutor, would be much more integral to running this deck smoothly than fetch spells or Scute Mob. You're on the right track with your suggestions, but this deck still has other bases it needs to cover first. Also, Genesis Wave would be a very fun spell to run once you hit 11+ mana. Top 8 permanents of your library onto the battlefield immediately. I'd actually consider running that as opposed to Green Sun's Zenith, as it also includes huge potential for landfall and creature advantage.
Good point. Bloom would be overkill and the draw could be vital. Genesis wave could be pretty sick!
Hey guys, I have a newer version of this deck that is standard here: http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=145830 There is also the U/G mill version: http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=145324
Wait this deck no longer has 40 forests. i feel jipped
run 16 forests with 4 misty rainforest and 4 verdant catacombs, then just search up the lands with khalni heart expedition, cultivate, explore, use fauna shaman or green sun zenith to tutor up liege