Zombie23

Seems like 24 mountains could be too many since every single creature is 2 or less mana. You could cut that to 20 I believe and now you have room for 4 more threats!

Haha, that's a cool deck! Love that you are using Rogue's Passage. Nobody ever seems to use that card and in certain situations it's great!

Also love the Rime Transfusion...never heard of it and it's awesome!

Have you considered something like "Vulshok Sorcerer" or some sort of Hastey Sniper card?

I agree 100%. However my friends get upset about "Tinker." So in my group it's kind of outlawed.

Thanks! I tested it out and I think there's too many high mana cards. Perhaps more cancel spells than I usually like to use. Me personally I do better with removal than I do with cancels. So perhaps I take the "Counterspell" out and keep the "Stoic Rebuttal." Then add some good old fashioned removal. On top of that, I wonder if I need the two "Steel Hellkite?" Maybe I can replace that with something earlier game or more answers to things?

I appreciate the help guys!

Nice! I love Surgical Extraction. Typically is someone cancels one of my spells I just extract the rest of their cancels. Plus it gives you a look at their whole deck.

Okay, I tested the deck again with the changes discussed previously.

1. Aggro couldn't keep up with the increased lifegain from Nighthawk and Sangromancer.
2. Still good against control.
3. Decent against mid-range. Mid-Range seems to be a slower matchup because the creatures are good and I end up relying on Upkeep damage from "The Rack" etc.

I have to say that I like it a lot now. It runs very consistent. In my current meta we just play casual and nobody sideboards. In the even that I create a sideboard, I think I can improve on the mid-range play if needed.

Yea I figure Surgical Extraction is good in any black deck, but especially with them discarding you get some great targets for it.

Yea that is a good idea. I don't have Blackmail, but I think I see the point. I could add Despise or Duress perhaps? I'll test it a couple ways and see.

Okay LOL....changed my mind on Sorin's Vengeance....just feels way too slow for this deck with no ramp.

1. Took out the 3 Sorin's Vengeance and add 4 Surgical Extraction.
2. Took out the rest of the Megrims 2 and then had room for one more card. Decided to use 1 Shrieking Affliction which is "The Rack" and also means I can stack more and more upkeep damage assuming they don't have enchantment removal.

Ugh, hopefully this is a good build....we shall see!

Hmm, just playing around with some things. Here are the possible changes I'm considering.

1. Go down from 4 to 2 Megrim.
2. Go from Black Sun's Zenith to Mutilate because it's a tad faster in the beginning of the game.
3. Took out the 4 Ravenous Rats and added 4 Vampire Nighthawk for defense and lifegain.
4. Added a 4th Painful Quandry since those stacking is just brutal.
5. Added 3 Sorin's Vengeance as an alternate win condition. (**Note that I am worried about the 7 mana**)
6. Took out the 1 Liliana Vess
7. Took our 1 Scepter ( I still like scepter as a consistent discard engine)

What do you guys think?

Thank you for you comments on my deck and I figured I'd come visit your deck.

The success rate you mentioned speaks for itself! As I was looking at the cards I found myself feeling greedy because I'd hate to make myself discard like so many of these cards do. I mean greedy because I want them to have no hand while I have one LOL.

However, with Ensnaring Bridge I can see the benefits here. On my page you mentioned that all black decks should have Dark Ritual. I love that card! However, most of your deck runs on 3 mana. Seems to me that you could easily replace Dark Ritual with some more control or something and not really miss them. Like perhaps add a couple "Go for the Throat" and a couple "Ultimate Price." You would definitely know better than me since you play the deck.

Hey thanks a lot for the feedback. This was experimental and I had to build with cards I have in my collection. I built it and ran it against a few different types of decks and here are the results.

1. Aggro killed me more often than I got them. Just need a couple more turns and aggro wouldn't allow that lol.
2. Control, obviously control hates to be discarded so there was a good success rate there.
3. Midrange decks this won most games because it got the time it needs.

I agree with your feedback 100%. I had many games where I just plain had no use for Liliana's Caress and Megrim because they had nothing to discard. However this was not my problem as much as just not having any defense up most games. That was truly my problem against aggro. Feels like maybe having Vampire Nighthawks would really help. One thing you did not mention in your comment that I was surprised about was the power of "The Rack" and "Nezumi Shortfang." Provided you get those cards out somehow you can do guarenteed damage every single upkeep and kill them rather fast. I had a few games where they were taking 6 damage at their upkeep. So that is a very good reason to use Megrim and Caress and then sit back on "The Rack" and "Nezumi" who actually transforms into "The Rack."

The deck needs something to stall though. Any suggestion? I considered Vampire Nighthawk because he is a great defense and the lifelink could buy me a turn or two.

Let me know what you think and I love getting feedback!

Glad to hear it! Now if I may...is there a way to get a stronger theme in the deck? i.e. mill or perhaps control, etc. If so, I believe we could find a very cheap and budget way to get you playsets or four of the cards that will really help the theme and make the deck a lot stronger. The trick to a deck in my humble opinion is to find a way to make it work "most" of the time. The only times it may not work is bad luck in the form of getting "mana screwed" (not pulling enough mana) or "mana flooded" (too much mana and no action). Otherwise my tried and tested decks never fail to accomplish their goal. This usually means a playset of all the cards that get you there or close to that. If you want to play "Azorius" (blue/white), then I would definitely suggest playing a control heavy deck (cancels, slow down methods, then a win condition that comes later). If you like "Mill" (attack their library) then I would highly suggest you go with "Dimir" colors which is black and blue. I only want to help, please let me know if you want more suggestions/ideas. Magic is such a wonderful game. I feel like all my decks are my creations and when they succeed it's such a beautiful feeling. My first deck was a white lifegain deck and it worked pretty well in my group. Please feel free to reach out and I'd love to talk more on your starting decks.

I will say that one of my worst habits for a good year or so was going over 60 cards in a deck. I highly suggest that you find ways to keep them at 60 for the best consistency. But hey! Ultimately just do what is fun for you!

Not sure if it's been mentioned already or not. Have you considered Butcher Ghoul? 2 drop Undying zombie. Seems like it would go perfect for the sacrifice aspect and it just comes back. You could then use your Tragic Slip on it and sacrifice it again only to have it come back yet again I believe. Could be wrong though.

Have you considered Festering Goblin?

I like the Cackling Counterpart because it also has flash. Still a tad slow if your current meta is 1v1. I play in a group that's mainly 3 Headed Giant. So I have more than enough time to play all the expensive mill. Mind Funeral is the most feared.

I believe there are a couple wolves in Avacyn that cant be blocked by anything weaker than them...similar to Aura Knarlid. Might be worth it.

Well if you are not keeping this standard, then Hedron Crabs are an absolute must. Also, consider Increasing Confusion.

My non-standard mill deck is B/U. My favorite card in that deck is Mind Funeral.

I like Jace for mill...Not crazy about Mindcrank. Mindcrank operates on damage, and this deck doesn't really dish damage. Belltower Sphinx or something could help get some damage. Although you say this is for team games which means damage will probably happen via your teammates. Therefore I suggest using it during teams, but if you go 1v1 maybe take it out and thin your deck by 2 cards.